[kwlug-disc] KWLUG is changing

Bob Jonkman bjonkman at sobac.com
Thu Jan 5 18:39:31 EST 2017 

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Perhaps someone could fill in the second slot in February to tell us
what Kanban is, and perhaps to show off a FAIF implementation of it.
We can then decide if we want to use it on the KWLUG website.

Paul, is the new host providing shared hosting, or a VPS? If it's a
VPS it should be reasonably easy to add additional services like a
Kanban application. Or a GNUsocial instance :-D

- --Bob.



On 2017-01-05 05:39 PM, Chamunks wrote:
> Kanban is basically one big sticky note board to-do list.
> 
> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 5:08 PM B. S. <bs27975 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> D'oh. 10-4.
>> 
>> I think I fell into the trap of thinking tasklist, and should
>> know better - MS Project is not 'just' a tasklist, and (merely)
>> thinking of it that way is counter-productive.
>> 
>> Just pulling up
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanban_(development) reminds me of
>> that.
>> 
>> Regardless, someone will have to run (non-technical) point /
>> facilitate this.
>> 
>> Nominations? Willing to be 'nomikneed'?
>> 
>> 
>> On 01/05/2017 04:49 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>> I'm a bit allergic to making people sign up for stuff how about
>>> if we
>> can't
>>> wait till next week that I throw up a public google spreadsheet
>>> that's globally editable.
>>> 
>>> Also pre pre planning may be a bit pre emptive. Let me spend
>>> some time
>> this
>>> weekend getting my head around the list that started this
>>> discussion and try to Kanbanize it all.
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 4:38 PM B. S. <bs27975 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Even if it were present this second, it would still take time
>>> for people to gather, gather their thoughts, and 'publish' them
>>> - be it electronically or verbally / in person.
>>> 
>>> Arguably people should go to checkvist now and start doing so.
>>> Heck, they can even start collaborating there if they're so
>>> inclined.
>>> 
>>> Presumably kanban can import a csv or whatever.
>>> 
>>> The lack of a kanban site this second isn't a hindrance. Heck,
>>> just sinking into kanban will be a milestone in an of itself.
>>> 
>>> At this point, arguably, a technical roadmap for organizing
>>> the organization is set (or would be found without too much
>>> difficulty, e.g. checkvist).
>>> 
>>> Next, and perhaps more immediately, is who will PM / facilitate
>>> things? Presumably it should not be Paul (he is, after all, the
>>> one who called Uncle! / for help.). I'm not sure if any of the
>>> current do'ers could also be impartial facilitators -
>>> presumably they'll be too busy do'ing, given their familiarity
>>> with the ecosystem.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 01/05/2017 04:21 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>> @B.S, I'm perfectly fine with the idea of setting out the
>>>> Kanban board
>> and
>>>> throwing together an example of how I imagine it working. I
>>>> have a major release for a project coming up this weekend so
>>>> it won't even start
>>> getting
>>>> looked at until Monday on my end. I might foot the tab for a
>>>> temporary
>> VM
>>>> at digital ocean or something until I've got something more
>>>> stable that
>> I
>>>> can run from home possibly behind a Cloudflare cache/reverse
>>>> proxy for
>> the
>>>> sake of responsiveness and uptime.
>>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 3:57 PM B.S. <bs27975.2 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Mixing many messages here ...
>>>>> 
>>>>> I am completely unfamiliar with kanban, but would happily
>>>>> participate.
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 01/05/2017 02:01 PM, Paul Nijjar via kwlug-disc wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 05, 2017 at 08:09:33AM +0000, Chamunks
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> I believe that a Kanban will be ideal since we
>>>>>>> basically just need a fancy collaborative to-do list.
>>>>>>> This way positions can be unofficial and the first
>>>>>>> available person who is capable of picking up a task
>>>>>>> can just cherry pick what they want to do and one or
>>>>>>> two people can just be responsible for chasing up
>>>>>>> people who have checked out items.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A few comments:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> - If you would like to set up a Kanban board then feel
>>>>>> free to do so.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Yes please.
>>>>> 
>>>>>> - I don't think I can promise that it will live on the
>>>>>> new webhost.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It shouldn't at this time, until participants are so
>>>>> comfortable. Arguably it would be a second / different task
>>>>> list. (Friends of, vs users of, vs admins of?) Let alone
>>>>> keeps the noise level down for those not interested.
>>>>> 
>>>>>> - Are you proposing this just for the transition or for
>>>>>> the monthly task list?
>>>>> 
>>>>> It can be both. The latter tasks would be recurring. The
>>>>> master of the recurring tasks would be assigned to someone
>>>>> (Andrew), as, as pointed out, that master role would mostly
>>>>> be to see that someone is assigned
>> to
>>>>> / carrying it out that month.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Presumably the initial one-off tasks can be 'archived' well
>>>>> after the fact. e.g. This is, what, the nth proposed Drupal
>>>>> upgrade? And not likely to be the last.
>>>>> 
>>>>>> - Just because I have divided up the tasks in an 
>>>>>> arbitrary way does not mean that people cannot cherry
>>>>>> pick tasks they want to work on.  There are not currently
>>>>>> clearly defined roles ...
>>>>> 
>>>>> In this context, tasks become roles. Doesn't mean they
>>>>> can't be grouped in categories (I assume). I think your
>>>>> original list is more a list of categories (tags?), within
>>>>> which there would be many tasks (Roles).
>> [See
>>>>> that x gets done. x may have a .1, .2, .3, etc.]
>>>>> 
>>>>>> - A Kanban board does not solve the problem of people
>>>>>> stepping up to do the tasks. At the end of the day
>>>>>> somebody has to make sure that the tasks are done.
>>>>> 
>>>>> This is a matter of participants signing up, and, as noted,
>>>>> picking
>> (and
>>>>> completing) tasks. Only time would tell / prove /
>>>>> demonstrate success, or not.
>>>>> 
>>>>> People have offered to participate. I'm guessing kanban (or
>>>>> any collaborative task list), which inherently forces the
>>>>> tasks to be explicit / public / visible / always in your
>>>>> face, may now provide them a more transparent vehicle by
>>>>> which to do so.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I assume there is a concept of a task owner (vs assigned),
>>>>> task master, or the like.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 01/05/2017 02:30 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>>>> I can coach or be involved in social but I'm very unsure
>>>>>> of committing just yet. ...
>>>>> 
>>>>> If all you (can) do at the moment is set it up and be the
>>>>> Kanban (use) master / coach / admin that would be wonderful
>>>>> and more than
>> sufficient.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Buys people time to join, participate, and become
>>>>> comfortable with the beastie. Let's them focus on structure
>>>>> / organization (which will be no small discussion), and
>>>>> executing, while for at least the moment not having to
>>>>> worry about how to keep the lights on.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 01/05/2017 02:47 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>>>> That would be cool but I'd personally think that we
>>>>>> should keep the Drupal more purpose built.
>>>>> 
>>>>> This message thread is about the admin of the group, not
>>>>> the group usage. The site is user usage.
>>>>> 
>>>>> For this moment, this should be a non-site kwlug admin
>>>>> kanban.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Not to say it shouldn't be added later, but I think the
>>>>> 'roles' need to be threshed out first. i.e. group admin
>>>>> tasks vs user / group usage tasks. Once the 'admins' are
>>>>> comfortable with 'things'.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I could be wrong on that. Running the group being separate
>>>>> than using / participating in the group - mmm, perhaps
>>>>> that's a reflection of things to date rather than as they
>>>>> could be. Groups run themselves, I suppose
>> -
>>>>> but to date kwlug has been run by the 'active' few. Maybe
>>>>> kanban will change that / spread the load. Engender more
>>>>> participation - at which point it would be a site thing.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 01/05/2017 02:30 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>>>> I can coach or be involved in social but I'm very unsure
>>>>>> of committing just yet. So first I would like to get a
>>>>>> FLOSS approvable Kanban solution setup for tracking or
>>>>>> project here so that there is at least one centralized
>>>>>> place we can get the overview. Taiga seems like the most
>>>>>> complete and active solution but has a bit of
>> coupling
>>>>>> involved plus I'm not certain what I'll do for hosting
>>>>>> just yet for it. I'll see if digital ocean or someone
>>>>>> like this will donate a VM or something.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 2:03 PM Paul Nijjar via kwlug-disc
>>>>>> < kwlug-disc at kwlug.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 05, 2017 at 08:09:33AM +0000, Chamunks
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> I believe that a Kanban will be ideal since we
>>>>>>>> basically just need a
>>>>>>> fancy
>>>>>>>> collaborative to-do list.  This way positions can be
>>>>>>>> unofficial and the first available person who is
>>>>>>>> capable of picking up a task can just
>>>>>>> cherry
>>>>>>>> pick what they want to do and one or two people can
>>>>>>>> just be responsible
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> chasing up people who have checked out items.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> A few comments:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> - If you would like to set up a Kanban board then feel
>>>>>>> free to do so. I don't think I can promise that it will
>>>>>>> live on the new webhost. - Are you proposing this just
>>>>>>> for the transition or for the monthly task list? - Just
>>>>>>> because I have divided up the tasks in an arbitrary way
>>>>>>> does not mean that people cannot cherry pick tasks they
>>>>>>> want to work on. There are not currently clearly
>>>>>>> defined roles because these are the things I am doing.
>>>>>>> But we do not need well defined roles. We just need
>>>>>>> tasks to get done. - A Kanban board does not solve the
>>>>>>> problem of people stepping up to do the tasks. At the
>>>>>>> end of the day somebody has to make sure that the tasks
>>>>>>> are done.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Also is there a way that I can send my phone number
>>>>>>>> to people without it being published in the mailing
>>>>>>>> list archives so that I can be reached if anyone has
>>>>>>>> questions about my maniacal schemes for KWLUG
>>>>>>>> organization.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> You can email individuals but there is not a good way
>>>>>>> to share your number with the list.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> With respect to your other email: Bob publicized our
>>>>>>> social media presences (most of which are on the front
>>>>>>> page of kwlug.org as well). Are you volunteering to
>>>>>>> liven up the social media component of KWLUG? If it
>>>>>>> excites you then you should run with it, especially on
>>>>>>> those platforms where Bob is not very active.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
>>>>> mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org 
>>>>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
>>>> mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org 
>>>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
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>>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
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>>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
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>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
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- -- 


- --
Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com>          Phone: +1-519-635-9413
SOBAC Microcomputer Services             http://sobac.com/sobac/
Software   ---   Office & Business Automation   ---   Consulting
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