[kwlug-disc] KWLUG is changing

Thu Jan 5 17:06:48 EST 2017

D'oh. 10-4.

I think I fell into the trap of thinking tasklist, and should know 
better - MS Project is not 'just' a tasklist, and (merely) thinking of 
it that way is counter-productive.

Just pulling up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanban_(development) 
reminds me of that.

Regardless, someone will have to run (non-technical) point / facilitate 
this.

Nominations? Willing to be 'nomikneed'?

On 01/05/2017 04:49 PM, Chamunks wrote:
> I'm a bit allergic to making people sign up for stuff how about if we can't
> wait till next week that I throw up a public google spreadsheet that's
> globally editable.
>
> Also pre pre planning may be a bit pre emptive. Let me spend some time this
> weekend getting my head around the list that started this discussion and
> try to Kanbanize it all.
>
> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 4:38 PM B. S. <bs27975 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Even if it were present this second, it would still take time for people
> to gather, gather their thoughts, and 'publish' them - be it
> electronically or verbally / in person.
>
> Arguably people should go to checkvist now and start doing so. Heck,
> they can even start collaborating there if they're so inclined.
>
> Presumably kanban can import a csv or whatever.
>
> The lack of a kanban site this second isn't a hindrance. Heck, just
> sinking into kanban will be a milestone in an of itself.
>
> At this point, arguably, a technical roadmap for organizing the
> organization is set (or would be found without too much difficulty, e.g.
> checkvist).
>
> Next, and perhaps more immediately, is who will PM / facilitate things?
> Presumably it should not be Paul (he is, after all, the one who called
> Uncle! / for help.). I'm not sure if any of the current do'ers could
> also be impartial facilitators - presumably they'll be too busy do'ing,
> given their familiarity with the ecosystem.
>
>
> On 01/05/2017 04:21 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>> @B.S, I'm perfectly fine with the idea of setting out the Kanban board and
>> throwing together an example of how I imagine it working. I have a major
>> release for a project coming up this weekend so it won't even start
> getting
>> looked at until Monday on my end. I might foot the tab for a temporary VM
>> at digital ocean or something until I've got something more stable that I
>> can run from home possibly behind a Cloudflare cache/reverse proxy for the
>> sake of responsiveness and uptime.
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 3:57 PM B.S. <bs27975.2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Mixing many messages here ...
>>>
>>> I am completely unfamiliar with kanban, but would happily participate.
>>>
>>> On 01/05/2017 02:01 PM, Paul Nijjar via kwlug-disc wrote:
>>>> On Thu, Jan 05, 2017 at 08:09:33AM +0000, Chamunks wrote:
>>>>> I believe that a Kanban will be ideal since we basically just need
>>>>>    a fancy collaborative to-do list.  This way positions can be
>>>>> unofficial and the first available person who is capable of
>>>>> picking up a task can just cherry pick what they want to do and one
>>>>> or two people can just be responsible for chasing up people who
>>>>> have checked out items.
>>>>
>>>> A few comments:
>>>>
>>>> - If you would like to set up a Kanban board then feel free to do
>>>> so.
>>>
>>> Yes please.
>>>
>>>> - I don't think I can promise that it will live on the new webhost.
>>>
>>> It shouldn't at this time, until participants are so comfortable.
>>> Arguably it would be a second / different task list. (Friends of, vs
>>> users of, vs admins of?) Let alone keeps the noise level down for those
>>> not interested.
>>>
>>>> - Are you proposing this just for the transition or for the monthly
>>>> task list?
>>>
>>> It can be both. The latter tasks would be recurring. The master of the
>>> recurring tasks would be assigned to someone (Andrew), as, as pointed
>>> out, that master role would mostly be to see that someone is assigned to
>>> / carrying it out that month.
>>>
>>> Presumably the initial one-off tasks can be 'archived' well after the
>>> fact. e.g. This is, what, the nth proposed Drupal upgrade? And not
>>> likely to be the last.
>>>
>>>> - Just because I have divided up the tasks in an
>>>> arbitrary way does not mean that people cannot cherry pick tasks they
>>>> want to work on.  There are not currently clearly defined roles ...
>>>
>>> In this context, tasks become roles. Doesn't mean they can't be grouped
>>> in categories (I assume). I think your original list is more a list of
>>> categories (tags?), within which there would be many tasks (Roles). [See
>>> that x gets done. x may have a .1, .2, .3, etc.]
>>>
>>>> - A Kanban board does
>>>> not solve the problem of people stepping up to do the tasks. At the
>>>> end of the day somebody has to make sure that the tasks are done.
>>>
>>> This is a matter of participants signing up, and, as noted, picking (and
>>> completing) tasks. Only time would tell / prove / demonstrate success,
>>> or not.
>>>
>>> People have offered to participate. I'm guessing kanban (or any
>>> collaborative task list), which inherently forces the tasks to be
>>> explicit / public / visible / always in your face, may now provide them
>>> a more transparent vehicle by which to do so.
>>>
>>> I assume there is a concept of a task owner (vs assigned), task master,
>>> or the like.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 01/05/2017 02:30 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>    > I can coach or be involved in social but I'm very unsure of
>>>    > committing just yet. ...
>>>
>>> If all you (can) do at the moment is set it up and be the Kanban (use)
>>> master / coach / admin that would be wonderful and more than sufficient.
>>>
>>> Buys people time to join, participate, and become comfortable with the
>>> beastie. Let's them focus on structure / organization (which will be no
>>> small discussion), and executing, while for at least the moment not
>>> having to worry about how to keep the lights on.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 01/05/2017 02:47 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>> That would be cool but I'd personally think that we should keep the
>>>> Drupal more purpose built.
>>>
>>> This message thread is about the admin of the group, not the group
>>> usage. The site is user usage.
>>>
>>> For this moment, this should be a non-site kwlug admin kanban.
>>>
>>> Not to say it shouldn't be added later, but I think the 'roles' need to
>>> be threshed out first. i.e. group admin tasks vs user / group usage
>>> tasks. Once the 'admins' are comfortable with 'things'.
>>>
>>> I could be wrong on that. Running the group being separate than using /
>>> participating in the group - mmm, perhaps that's a reflection of things
>>> to date rather than as they could be. Groups run themselves, I suppose -
>>> but to date kwlug has been run by the 'active' few. Maybe kanban will
>>> change that / spread the load. Engender more participation - at which
>>> point it would be a site thing.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 01/05/2017 02:30 PM, Chamunks wrote:
>>>> I can coach or be involved in social but I'm very unsure of
>>>> committing just yet. So first I would like to get a FLOSS approvable
>>>>    Kanban solution setup for tracking or project here so that there is
>>>>    at least one centralized place we can get the overview. Taiga seems
>>>>    like the most complete and active solution but has a bit of coupling
>>>>    involved plus I'm not certain what I'll do for hosting just yet for
>>>>    it. I'll see if digital ocean or someone like this will donate a VM
>>>>    or something.
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017, 2:03 PM Paul Nijjar via kwlug-disc <
>>>> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jan 05, 2017 at 08:09:33AM +0000, Chamunks wrote:
>>>>>> I believe that a Kanban will be ideal since we basically just
>>>>>> need a
>>>>> fancy
>>>>>> collaborative to-do list.  This way positions can be unofficial
>>>>>> and the first available person who is capable of picking up a
>>>>>> task can just
>>>>> cherry
>>>>>> pick what they want to do and one or two people can just be
>>>>>> responsible
>>>>> for
>>>>>> chasing up people who have checked out items.
>>>>>
>>>>> A few comments:
>>>>>
>>>>> - If you would like to set up a Kanban board then feel free to do
>>>>> so. I don't think I can promise that it will live on the new
>>>>> webhost. - Are you proposing this just for the transition or for
>>>>> the monthly task list? - Just because I have divided up the tasks
>>>>> in an arbitrary way does not mean that people cannot cherry pick
>>>>> tasks they want to work on. There are not currently clearly defined
>>>>> roles because these are the things I am doing. But we do not need
>>>>> well defined roles. We just need tasks to get done. - A Kanban
>>>>> board does not solve the problem of people stepping up to do the
>>>>> tasks. At the end of the day somebody has to make sure that the
>>>>> tasks are done.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Also is there a way that I can send my phone number to people
>>>>>> without it being published in the mailing list archives so that I
>>>>>> can be reached if anyone has questions about my maniacal schemes
>>>>>> for KWLUG organization.
>>>>>
>>>>> You can email individuals but there is not a good way to share
>>>>> your number with the list.
>>>>>
>>>>> With respect to your other email: Bob publicized our social media
>>>>> presences (most of which are on the front page of kwlug.org as
>>>>> well). Are you volunteering to liven up the social media component
>>>>>    of KWLUG? If it excites you then you should run with it,
>>>>> especially on those platforms where Bob is not very active.
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
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