[kwlug-disc] laptops with Linux preinstalled

Mon Mar 1 17:29:48 EST 2021

On Sat, Feb 27, 2021, at 1:36 PM, Ron Singh wrote:
> I detest trackpads and love the trackpoint except when I have to use a graphical app and a mouse comes into play there.

I've been using a Macbook Air since 2010, and the trackpad is phenomenal. I want that kind of trackpad on my linux laptop, and I have no interest in using a trackpoint.

Part of a good trackpad is the hardware, and part is the software. The mechanical aspects of the hardware make a big difference, so does the firmware inside the trackpad, and so does the driver installed in the OS. GUI toolkit and application support for touch gestures is also important. You need to get all of this right to get a good (Mac-like) experience.

In my experience with Thinkpad 14/4xx models, the trackpad hardware is terrible, even under Windows. On Linux, the trackpad drivers are not consistently good (based on reports), but some trackpads behave way better than others. The Apple Magic Touchpad is said to behave very nicely under Linux. So, it's important to start with good hardware that has good firmware? And there hasn't been Linux driver support for the full range of touch gestures, so applications can't be programmed to support those gestures.

But, I am replacing my Thinkpad trackpad with the P1 model. To quote reddit:
    https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/j0ulfk/glass_trackpad_in_t14/
    I just installed a glass trackpad for the P1 / X1 into our T14. The
    performance (accuracy, smoothness, etc.) so far is NIGHT AND DAY from the
    stock T14 Gen 1 junk trackpad that our machines all have. The trackpad
    works like it should now!

As for the software, Bill Harding has been pursuing the goal of achieving a Linux trackpad experience as good as the Mac for several years now.
  https://bill.harding.blog/2017/12/27/toward-a-linux-touchpad-as-smooth-as-macbook-pro/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2018/01/07/linux-with-a-macbook-touchpad-feel-pt-2/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2018/04/12/linux-touchpad-like-a-macbook-goal-worth-pursuing/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2019/03/25/linux-touchpad-like-a-macbook-progress-and-a-call-for-help/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2020/04/26/linux-touchpad-like-a-macbook-pro-may-2020-update/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2020/05/17/linux-touchpad-preliminary-project-funding-survey-results/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2020/06/22/linux-touchpad-project-update-progress-on-multitouch/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2020/10/06/q3-linux-touchpad-like-macbook-update-multitouch-gesture-test-packages-are-ready/
  https://bill.harding.blog/2021/02/11/linux-touchpad-like-a-mac-update-firefox-gesture-support-goes-live/

Bill's project is initially focused on providing the Mac & Windows multitouch gestures that are missing from Linux. At present, to get gesture support (eg, pinch-zoom and 3-finger swipe), I need to use Wayland (which uses libinput), plus Gnome. GTK applications have access to libinput gesture support, other GUI toolkits (like Qt) do not. Bill's project is working to get gesture support into X11, gui toolkits like Qt (used by KDE), and major applications.

So I should try Wayland and Gnome. Peter Hutterer, the libinput dev who is working with Bill Harding, works for Red Hat. Maybe Fedora will have the best trackpad experience, once I install known good trackpad hardware?

I would like to try implementing gestures in my 3D modelling software, Curv, so this would help me get there.

Doug Moen.

> 
> In Ubuntu/Mint 20.x, I found the trackpad/trackpoint to have poor acceleration control(as in none) even after playing around with the slider bars to adjust things. Laptop is my daughter's T560.
> The main dev with the Xfce project suggested I mess around with the data tables dealing with mouse movements, which is way past the ability of my monkey brain. 
> Mint's website suggests that I rip out the <libinput> package and try the <synaptic> package and as a last resort, toss the both the <synaptic> package and the <libinput> package and try the <evdev> package. Eureka! My daughter loved me again. Problem solved.
> 
> I use real old T420/T520/X220 as my dailies and had the same issue as above, the <evdev> package fixed it for me. 
> This issue only happened in Ubu 20.04.0 and 20.04.1, not the 16.4.x editions. I have not done the 20.04.2 point release update yet.
> 
> In Synaptic,
> 
> remove -- xserver-xorg-input-libinput
> install -- xserver-xorg-input-evdev
> 
> By remove, I mean "remove", *not* "complete removal".
> 
> FWIW.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ron S.
> 
> 
> On Sat, Feb 27, 2021 at 9:32 AM Khalid Baheyeldin <kb at 2bits.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 10:27 PM Doug Moen <doug at moens.org> wrote:
>>> The trackpad is bad. It's actually worse than the trackpad in my T450, which I didn't think possible.
>> 
>> I am typing this from my Thinkpad T450, which I bought used (I think it was $150).
>> I did disable the trackpad and use an external mouse. When in a pinch, I use the 
>> trackpoint, on the advice of Ron Singh on this list. But still it is cumbersome.
>> -- 
>> Khalid M. Baheyeldin
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