[kwlug-disc] Accepting bitcoin (and other cryptos) as a Canadian business

Tue Oct 24 17:02:59 EDT 2017

Internet rumours that I've heard is that anyone who accepts bitcoin
payments sees that method bring in about 0% of their sales volume. From a
generating-some-buzz perspective it may pay off though.

On Tue, 24 Oct 2017 at 10:41 Darcy Casselman <dscassel at gmail.com> wrote:

> DVLB in Uptown accepted bitcoin at some point through some service. Not
> sure if they still do. You could ask them about their experience.
>
> On Fri, Oct 20, 2017 at 1:41 PM, Chamunks <chamunks at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'll ask my CPA about this at some point and report back whenever I do
>> that.
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 20, 2017 at 12:38 PM Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> wrote:
>>
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>>> Chamunks wrote:
>>> > So @Bob you're saying it's better to just cash out the 13% out of
>>> > BTC and bank that for tax day?
>>>
>>> I don't know if it's "better", but it's certainly more straightforward.
>>>
>>> Until CRA starts accepting BTC as a payment method it needs to be
>>> handled as a foreign currency. And I'm not sure if BTC is recognized
>>> as a foreign currency, so then it may need to be dealt with as barter.
>>> IANAA, YMMV, ETC.
>>>
>>> Joel wrote:
>>> > Your thinking is on the right track but I wouldn't record it that
>>> > way.
>>>
>>> Thanx Joel! As you point out, there are different ways of recording
>>> the transaction, and different payment schedules to CRA. Retaining a
>>> tax accountant for a small business is a prudent move.
>>>
>>> - --Bob.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2017-10-20 06:31 AM, Joel Nahrgang wrote:
>>> >> Not a tax accountant by any means
>>> >
>>> > I'm not a CPA, but worked in public accounting for over 20 years,
>>> > including tax.
>>> >
>>> > Your thinking is on the right track but I wouldn't record it that
>>> > way.
>>> >
>>> > You make a sale for $100 CDN and charge $13 CDN for hst (13%). You
>>> > would owe cra $13 for HST if that is all you did in the filing
>>> > period. Regardless of what currency it is in, you just owe $13
>>> > CDN.
>>> >
>>> > If you happen to get paid in bitcoin, using Bob's example and
>>> > received 1 BTC, that is what would show on your balance sheet until
>>> > the end of the year/quarter/month when you need to adjust all
>>> > currencies to reflect the CDN$ value.
>>> >
>>> > If those currencies are higher than the CDN$ equivalent, then the
>>> > difference is recorded as income and can be taxed on it, This would
>>> > just go into the overall income and your expenses would reduce the
>>> > income.
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Oct 19, 2017 at 9:52 PM, Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Remi Gauvin wrote:
>>> >>>> Not a tax accountant by any means
>>> >
>>> > Me neither.
>>> >
>>> >>>> If I traded $100 worth of my service for 1 BTC, then 2
>>> >>>> months later,
>>> > traded that 1 BTC for $150 cash (or equivalent goods/service), my
>>> > total taxable income would be $150
>>> >
>>> > This needs a tax accountant.  When I generate an invoice for
>>> > services rendered I charge HST (13%) at the time of invoicing.  So
>>> > if I perform a service for 1 BTC then I would charge 1 BTC + .13
>>> > BTC HST = 1.13 BTC.  CRA gets whatever that .13 BTC is worth at the
>>> > time the services are billed. The .13 BTC are not mine, and I can't
>>> > spend it or invest it.
>>> >
>>> > If two months down the road my 1 BTC has increased in value 1.5x
>>> > then that's a capital gains, just like any other investment. The .5
>>> > BTC would be taxed at whatever the capital gains is.
>>> >
>>> > --Bob.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On 2017-10-19 05:58 PM, Remi Gauvin wrote:
>>> >>>> On 17-10-19 04:37 PM, Andrew Stevanus (KWLUG) wrote:
>>> >>>>> The recent mention of the Humble Cryptocurrency Bundle and
>>> >>>>> the ensuing discussion reminded me of something that I've
>>> >>>>> been wondering about for a while. How would one go about
>>> >>>>> accepting bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies as a Canadian
>>> >>>>> business? Obviously, you'd still have to pay income tax, so
>>> >>>>> would you calculate the equivalent amount in CAD when you
>>> >>>>> received a payment and just use that? What exchange would
>>> >>>>> you get the price from? Does it matter? Do you use the
>>> >>>>> price when the invoice is generated, when the customer
>>> >>>>> sends the payment, or when it is actually confirmed on the
>>> >>>>> blockchain? Are there any additional rules that would apply
>>> >>>>> when accepting cryptocurrency versus CAD?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Not a tax accountant by any means, but if you'll allow to
>>> >>>> play one for a bit.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> I don't really think it matters a great deal how you convert
>>> >>>> value at the time you receive the coins, (so long as it's
>>> >>>> consistent and reasonable.  Basically, it would be the same
>>> >>>> as barter.).  However, that value would then further be
>>> >>>> converted to gain/loss when you dispose of said coins.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> ie.  If I traded $100 worth of my service for 1 BTC, then 2
>>> >>>> months later, traded that 1 BTC for $150 cash (or equivalent
>>> >>>> goods/service), my total taxable income would be $150.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc
>>> >>>> mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org
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>>> >>>>
>>> >
>>> >>
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>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
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>>>
>>> - --
>>> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com>          Phone: +1-519-635-9413
>>> <(519)%20635-9413>
>>> SOBAC Microcomputer Services             http://sobac.com/sobac/
>>> Software   ---   Office & Business Automation   ---   Consulting
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