From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 14:07:35 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 18:07:35 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards Message-ID: Hi everyone... I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rbclemen at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 14:27:38 2015 From: rbclemen at gmail.com (R. Brent Clements) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:27:38 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150901182738.5914699.9489.1691@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter_melse at gto.net Tue Sep 1 14:40:47 2015 From: peter_melse at gto.net (peter_melse at gto.net) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:40:47 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <29446e0833ed3f181b8ecb9d709944fd@gto.net> I'd look into usb sound cards, I've had good luck with the cheap ones. (and pulseaudio) ------------------------- SUBJECT: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards DATE: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 18:07:35 +0000 FROM: CrankyOldBugger TO: KWLUG discussion REPLY-TO: KWLUG discussion Hi everyone... I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rbclemen at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 14:45:28 2015 From: rbclemen at gmail.com (R. Brent Clements) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:45:28 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: <29446e0833ed3f181b8ecb9d709944fd@gto.net> References: <29446e0833ed3f181b8ecb9d709944fd@gto.net> Message-ID: <20150901184528.5914699.12299.1694@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter_melse at gto.net Tue Sep 1 14:51:58 2015 From: peter_melse at gto.net (peter_melse at gto.net) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:51:58 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: <20150901184528.5914699.12299.1694@gmail.com> References: <29446e0833ed3f181b8ecb9d709944fd@gto.net> <20150901184528.5914699.12299.1694@gmail.com> Message-ID: <36eaeb99d2f44a93cc40b912763257de@gto.net> ah yes OSS, I think the last time I encountered it in the wild was Mandrake 8.1 ------------------------- SUBJECT: Re: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards DATE: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:45:28 -0400 FROM: "R. Brent Clements" TO: "peter_melse at gto.net" REPLY-TO: KWLUG discussion Pulseaudio does not replace the need for alsa or OSS (depreciated) hardware level drivers. But yes, the USB audio devices are quite well supported Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network. FROM: peter_melse at gto.net SENT: Tuesday, September 1, 2015 2:43 PM TO: KWLUG discussion REPLY TO: KWLUG discussion SUBJECT: Re: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards I'd look into usb sound cards, I've had good luck with the cheap ones. (and pulseaudio) ------------------------- SUBJECT: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards DATE: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 18:07:35 +0000 FROM: CrankyOldBugger TO: KWLUG discussion REPLY-TO: KWLUG discussion Hi everyone... I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rbclemen at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 14:55:52 2015 From: rbclemen at gmail.com (R. Brent Clements) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:55:52 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150901185552.5914699.60134.1697@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter_melse at gto.net Tue Sep 1 15:08:48 2015 From: peter_melse at gto.net (peter_melse at gto.net) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 15:08:48 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: <20150901185552.5914699.60134.1697@gmail.com> References: <20150901185552.5914699.60134.1697@gmail.com> Message-ID: For configuring pulse audio, I highly recommend the program pavucontrol. it's graphical, gives you all the options and just works(ha, really) on most systems. ------------------------- SUBJECT: Re: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards DATE: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:55:52 -0400 FROM: "R. Brent Clements" TO: KWLUG discussion REPLY-TO: KWLUG discussion ?That is two message that my phone defaulted to a direct reply instead of posting to the group :-( Yes USB options are good. I think there is a 2in 2out (one stereo channel each way) device by behringer that is around 50 bucks now. More than an internal device obviously. I have used one on a Ubuntu laptop a few years ago. Worked immediately tho I had to tell pulseaudio to use it instead of the built in one Pulseaudio does not replace the need for alsa or OSS (depreciated) drivers. I will definitely spend a few minutes on the layers of sound processing on Linux during my November talk Brent Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network. FROM: CrankyOldBugger SENT: Tuesday, September 1, 2015 2:10 PM TO: KWLUG discussion REPLY TO: KWLUG discussion SUBJECT: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards Hi everyone... I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 19:55:55 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 23:55:55 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: <20150901185552.5914699.60134.1697@gmail.com> Message-ID: Now I never considered an external sound card before. Are you guys talking about the little USB sticks about the size of thumb drives, or the "set-top" boxes I see on Canada Computers? On Tue, 1 Sep 2015 at 15:11 wrote: > For configuring pulse audio, I highly recommend the program pavucontrol. > it's graphical, gives you all the options and just works(ha, really) on > most systems. > ------------------------------ > *Subject:* Re: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards > *Date:* Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:55:52 -0400 > *From:* "R. Brent Clements" > *To:* KWLUG discussion > *Reply-To:* KWLUG discussion > ?That is two message that my phone defaulted to a direct reply instead of > posting to the group :-( > > Yes USB options are good. I think there is a 2in 2out (one stereo channel > each way) device by behringer that is around 50 bucks now. More than an > internal device obviously. I have used one on a Ubuntu laptop a few years > ago. Worked immediately tho I had to tell pulseaudio to use it instead of > the built in one > > Pulseaudio does not replace the need for alsa or OSS (depreciated) > drivers. I will definitely spend a few minutes on the layers of sound > processing on Linux during my November talk > > Brent > > Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network. > *From: *CrankyOldBugger > *Sent: *Tuesday, September 1, 2015 2:10 PM > *To: *KWLUG discussion > *Reply To: *KWLUG discussion > *Subject: *[kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards > > > Hi everyone... > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy > FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, > Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' > website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. > > Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has > available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". > And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound > machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well > (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate > card). > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kwlug.org at ciotog.net Tue Sep 1 20:31:49 2015 From: kwlug.org at ciotog.net (Chris Craig) Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2015 20:31:49 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Cranky said: > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux > drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). Yes it does, it's a Realtek ALC898 based card which is supported by the snd_hda_intel module. I imagine the problem you're having is due to an on-board card that's registering as card0 (the default), leaving the Audigy FX as card1. Dealing with multiple sound cards has always been a pain, here's some people having similar trouble: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-hardware-18/getting-a-soundblaster-audigy-fx-to-work-4175505881/ On 1 September 2015 at 14:07, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > Hi everyone... > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) > in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). > Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I > noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. > > Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has > available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". And > being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound > machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well > (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate > card). > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > From peter_melse at gto.net Tue Sep 1 20:33:10 2015 From: peter_melse at gto.net (Peter Melse) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 20:33:10 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards Message-ID: <20150902003317894@smtp484.redcondor.net> The USB stick variety. There's a few around the 3$ range on amazon today. On Sep 1, 2015 7:55 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > > Now I never considered an external sound card before.? Are you guys talking about the little USB sticks about the size of thumb drives, or the "set-top" boxes I see on Canada Computers? > > > On Tue, 1 Sep 2015 at 15:11 wrote: >> >> For configuring pulse audio, I highly recommend the program pavucontrol. it's graphical, gives you all the options and just works(ha, really) on most systems. >> ________________________________ >> Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards >> Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:55:52 -0400 >> From: "R. Brent Clements" >> To: KWLUG discussion >> Reply-To: KWLUG discussion >> ?That is two message that my phone defaulted to a direct reply instead of posting to the group :-( >> ? >> Yes USB options are good. I think there is a 2in 2out (one stereo channel each way) device by behringer that is around 50 bucks now. More than an internal device obviously. I have used one on a Ubuntu laptop a few years ago. Worked immediately tho I had to tell pulseaudio to use it instead of the built in one >> ? >> Pulseaudio does not replace the need for alsa or OSS (depreciated) drivers. I will definitely spend a few minutes on the layers of sound processing on Linux during my November talk >> ? >> Brent >> ? >> Sent?from?my?BlackBerry?10?smartphone?on?the?Rogers?network. >> From: CrankyOldBugger >> Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2015 2:10 PM >> To: KWLUG discussion >> Reply To: KWLUG discussion >> Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards >> ? >> >> Hi everyone... >> ? >> I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu).? Windows side works fine.? In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. >> ? >> Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers?? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights".? And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). >> ? >> ? >> >> ? >> >> ? >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 1 23:00:47 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2015 03:00:47 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Now that's curious. I will investigate. But in my defense, the Creative Labs website didn't offer much hope for Linux drivers... On Tue, 1 Sep 2015 at 20:35 Chris Craig wrote: > Cranky said: > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy > FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux > > drivers (specifically, Ubuntu). > > Yes it does, it's a Realtek ALC898 based card which is supported by > the snd_hda_intel module. > > I imagine the problem you're having is due to an on-board card that's > registering as card0 (the default), leaving the Audigy FX as card1. > > Dealing with multiple sound cards has always been a pain, here's some > people having similar trouble: > > http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-hardware-18/getting-a-soundblaster-audigy-fx-to-work-4175505881/ > > On 1 September 2015 at 14:07, CrankyOldBugger > wrote: > > Hi everyone... > > > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy > FX) > > in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, > Ubuntu). > > Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I > > noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. > > > > Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has > > available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". > And > > being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound > > machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably > well > > (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a > separate > > card). > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kwlug-disc mailing list > > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Fri Sep 4 14:05:20 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2015 14:05:20 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Scribus/Indesign alternatives Message-ID: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> I am looking for an open-source, GUI page layout program like Scribus but better. It should run on Windows. LibreOffice is not that program. troff is not that program. LaTeX is not that program. Does such a program exist? Do any of you have actual experience with such a program? - Paul -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Fri Sep 4 14:29:21 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2015 18:29:21 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Scribus/Indesign alternatives In-Reply-To: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: alternativeto.net isn't very encourage: http://alternativeto.net/software/scribus/?license=free&platform=windows Basically Scribus got 184 votes, the next runner up got 14. On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 at 14:08 Paul Nijjar wrote: > > I am looking for an open-source, GUI page layout program like Scribus > but better. It should run on Windows. > > LibreOffice is not that program. > troff is not that program. > LaTeX is not that program. > > Does such a program exist? > > Do any of you have actual experience with such a program? > > - Paul > > -- > http://pnijjar.freeshell.org > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Fri Sep 4 16:04:55 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2015 20:04:55 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Scribus/Indesign alternatives In-Reply-To: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: <1473945387.1741051.1441397095329.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Inkscape? Google docs? >________________________________ > From: Paul Nijjar >To: kwlug-disc >Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 2:05 PM >Subject: [kwlug-disc] Scribus/Indesign alternatives > > > >I am looking for an open-source, GUI page layout program like Scribus >but better. It should run on Windows. > >LibreOffice is not that program. >troff is not that program. >LaTeX is not that program. > >Does such a program exist? > >Do any of you have actual experience with such a program? From chaslinux at gmail.com Fri Sep 4 17:39:00 2015 From: chaslinux at gmail.com (Charles M) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2015 17:39:00 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Scribus/Indesign alternatives In-Reply-To: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150904180520.GB3707@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: Paul if you're concerned about the Scribus learning curve have a look at the free Full Circle Magazine web site - they have special issues dedicated just to Scribus: http://fullcirclemagazine.org/scribus-special-edition/ On Fri, Sep 4, 2015 at 2:05 PM, Paul Nijjar wrote: > > I am looking for an open-source, GUI page layout program like Scribus > but better. It should run on Windows. > > LibreOffice is not that program. > troff is not that program. > LaTeX is not that program. > > Does such a program exist? > > Do any of you have actual experience with such a program? > > - Paul > > -- > http://pnijjar.freeshell.org > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -- Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaslinux at gmail.com Fri Sep 4 17:41:06 2015 From: chaslinux at gmail.com (Charles M) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2015 17:41:06 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: If you're willing to wait until Tuesday I can check at Computer Recycling (or Paul might be around). I know we had at least one I saved somewhere in the IT office. Not sure of the brand/make or where I left it in the office/my desk, but I know we had one. On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:07 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > Hi everyone... > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy > FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, > Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' > website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. > > Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has > available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". > And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound > machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well > (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate > card). > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -- Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Fri Sep 4 22:38:13 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2015 02:38:13 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Great of you guys to offer help. I'm going to try the card0/card1 thing first, then we'll all know for sure what happened. But no guarantees when I'll get to it; Wifeski is making me move the house a foot to the left again this weekend. Then assuming I still have some life in me, I'll take a crack at the config. On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 at 17:45 Charles M wrote: > If you're willing to wait until Tuesday I can check at Computer Recycling > (or Paul might be around). I know we had at least one I saved somewhere in > the IT office. Not sure of the brand/make or where I left it in the > office/my desk, but I know we had one. > > On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:07 PM, CrankyOldBugger > wrote: > >> Hi everyone... >> >> I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy >> FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, >> Ubuntu). Windows side works fine. In travelling around Creative Labs' >> website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. >> >> Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has >> available Linux drivers? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights". >> And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound >> machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well >> (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate >> card). >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> >> > > > -- > Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, > Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, > Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project > Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ > Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ > Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Sat Sep 5 01:45:14 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 01:45:14 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150905054514.GA8572@node1.localdomain> On Tue, Sep 01, 2015 at 08:31:49PM -0400, Chris Craig wrote: > Cranky said: > > I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs > > Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers > > (specifically, Ubuntu). > > Yes it does, it's a Realtek ALC898 based card which is supported by > the snd_hda_intel module. > > I imagine the problem you're having is due to an on-board card that's > registering as card0 (the default), leaving the Audigy FX as card1. > > Dealing with multiple sound cards has always been a pain, here's some > people having similar trouble: > http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-hardware-18/getting-a-soundblaster-audigy-fx-to-work-4175505881/ I had similar problem recently. In my case, builtin HDMI is card=0 (default) and ALC887 is card=1. You can configure MPlayer to use card=1, but Flash Player is hardcoded to use the default. So, I had to manually set card=1 as the default. I'm running Slackware-14.1 which is the latest for Slackware but old compared to other distros. Ubuntu/Fedora "Live" picked it up right away without manual intervention. So, I'm surprised that you're having problem with Ubuntu. To configure Audigy FX (say, card=1) as the default, edit ~/.asoundrc, defaults.ctl.card 1 defaults.pcm.card 1 defaults.pcm.device 0 where '1' or '0' should be adjusted to your card in question. Did you say you're going to buy me a beer? -- William From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Sat Sep 5 09:31:00 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 09:31:00 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards Message-ID: Liken in in nm On Sep 4, 2015 10:38 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > > Great of you guys to offer help.? I'm going to try the card0/card1 thing first, then we'll all know for sure what happened.? But no guarantees when I'll get to it; Wifeski is making me move the house a foot to the left again this weekend.? Then assuming I still have some life in me, I'll take a crack at the config. > > > On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 at 17:45 Charles M wrote: >> >> If you're willing to wait until Tuesday I can check at Computer Recycling (or Paul might be around). I know we had at least one I saved somewhere in the IT office. Not sure of the brand/make or where I left it in the office/my desk, but I know we had one. >> >> On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:07 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: >>> >>> Hi everyone... >>> >>> I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu).? Windows side works fine.? In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. >>> >>> Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers?? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights".? And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> kwlug-disc mailing list >>> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, >> Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, >> Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project >> Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ >> Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ >> Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Sat Sep 5 09:29:33 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 09:29:33 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cardsonmmkom Message-ID: On Sep 4, 2015 10:38 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > > Great of you guys to offer help.? I'm going to try the card0/card1 thing first, then we'll all know for sure what happened.? But no guarantees when I'll get to it; Wifeski is making me move the house a foot to the left again this weekend.? Then assuming I still have some life in me, I'll take a crack at the config. > > > On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 at 17:45 Charles M wrote: >> >> If you're willing to wait until Tuesday I can check at Computer Recycling (or Paul might be around). I know we had at least one I saved somewhere in the IT office. Not sure of the brand/make or where I left it in the office/my desk, but I know we had one. >> >> On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:07 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: >>> >>> Hi everyone... >>> >>> I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu).? Windows side works fine.? In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. >>> >>> Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers?? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights".? And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> kwlug-disc mailing list >>> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, >> Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, >> Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project >> Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ >> Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ >> Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Sat Sep 5 09:29:56 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 09:29:56 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Linux supported sound cards Message-ID: Mm xnnnoy On Sep 4, 2015 10:38 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > > Great of you guys to offer help.? I'm going to try the card0/card1 thing first, then we'll all know for sure what happened.? But no guarantees when I'll get to it; Wifeski is making me move the house a foot to the left again this weekend.? Then assuming I still have some life in me, I'll take a crack at the config. > > > On Fri, 4 Sep 2015 at 17:45 Charles M wrote: >> >> If you're willing to wait until Tuesday I can check at Computer Recycling (or Paul might be around). I know we had at least one I saved somewhere in the IT office. Not sure of the brand/make or where I left it in the office/my desk, but I know we had one. >> >> On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:07 PM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: >>> >>> Hi everyone... >>> >>> I just found out the other day that the sound card (Creative Labs Audigy FX) in my dual boot desktop doesn't have Linux drivers (specifically, Ubuntu).? Windows side works fine.? In travelling around Creative Labs' website, I noticed a serious lack of Linux commitment from CL. >>> >>> Does anyone have experience with any sort of PCI-e sound card that has available Linux drivers?? I value "cheap" over "lots of flashy lights".? And being half deaf, I don't really care for some audiophile-level sound machine, just something that can drive my external speakers reasonably well (the sound card on the motherboard has issues, thus my need for a separate card). >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> kwlug-disc mailing list >>> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >>> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Charles McColm, Author: Instant XBMC, >> Columnist: Full Circle Magazine, >> Project Manager: The Working Centre Computer Recycling Project >> Web: http://www.theworkingcentre.org/cr/ >> Blog: http://www.charlesmccolm.com/ >> Twitter/Identica/Google+: @chaslinux >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Sat Sep 5 09:30:23 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 09:30:23 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) Message-ID: Kinin m -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Sat Sep 5 09:31:23 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2015 09:31:23 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) Message-ID: Km Km uxn ICBM km I junk i -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Mon Sep 7 08:11:50 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2015 12:11:50 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42756385.2517886.1441627910509.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Joe, could you get the cat off the keyboard, please! (-: >________________________________ > From: Joseph Wennechuk >To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2015 9:31 AM >Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) > > > >Km Km uxn ICBM km I junk i From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Mon Sep 7 14:35:42 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2015 14:35:42 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) Message-ID: Hilarious.. That is exactly what happened... LMAO On Sep 7, 2015 8:11 AM, "B.S." wrote: > > Joe, could you get the cat off the keyboard, please! (-: > > > >________________________________ > > From: Joseph Wennechuk > >To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2015 9:31 AM > >Subject: [kwlug-disc] (no subject) > > > > > > > >Km Km uxn ICBM km I junk i > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > From bjonkman at sobac.com Tue Sep 8 21:03:00 2015 From: bjonkman at sobac.com (Bob Jonkman) Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2015 21:03:00 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Software Freedom Day Toronto, Saturday 19 September 2015 Message-ID: <55EF8544.7000600@sobac.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Everybody! I'd like to announce that Software Freedom Day is taking place in Toronto on Saturday, 19 September 2015 from 10:00am to 4:00pm This is the first time that SFD will be celebrated in Toronto! We've got presentations, lightning talks, and some Free Culture films. Admission is Free (as in Gratis), but *What*: Software Freedom Day Toronto *When*: Saturday 19 September 2015 from 10:00am to 4:00pm *Where*: 120 Carlton Avenue, Toronto, Ontario *Map*: http://osm.org/go/ZX6B46sH?m= *Website*: http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2015/Canada/Toronto/LibrePlanet Schedule ======== 10:00am - What Is Software Freedom (Sergio Durigan) 11:00am - Free Software in Musical Performance (Blaise Alleyne) 12:00n - Lighting Talks (Aruna Hewapathirane, Rudolf Olah) 2:30pm - Lunch and Free Culture Short Films 2:00pm - E-mail Privacy with Free Software (Bob Jonkman) 3:00pm - GnuPG/PGP Keysigning SFD presentations are free of charge. For lunch we're ordering out from Panago's Pizza -- $5.00 to get yours! SFDToronto is organized by members of LibrePlanet Ontario; the venue has been provided by our sponsor Alleyne, Inc. https://libreplanet.org/wiki/Group:LibrePlanet_Ontario http://alleyneinc.net/ - -- Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability iEYEARECAAYFAlXvhUEACgkQuRKJsNLM5epC1QCglqza4SwwR8lQtVrLwKU8M8H1 6RkAn1ExK63c+rAwb7G8IuKQUeK5IEjp =9Tyn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Thu Sep 10 11:13:46 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2015 11:13:46 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Last call Message-ID: <20150910151345.GA3765@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Does anybody have something to offer for the second half of Monday's meeting? Would anybody be interested in a roundtable on supporting new Linux users? (also if there are FLOSSy events for Sept you want me to publicize on -announce please submit them to me. I have a few already: Maker Expo, the CitizenFour screening, and Stephen Paul Weber's crowdfunding campaign) - Paul http://pnijjar.freeshell.org From kwlug.org at ciotog.net Thu Sep 10 13:31:55 2015 From: kwlug.org at ciotog.net (Chris Craig) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2015 13:31:55 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Last call In-Reply-To: <20150910151345.GA3765@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150910151345.GA3765@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: C# Dev/Connect is having a talk on C# in Linux on Tuesday, 2015-09-15 at 7pm http://www.meetup.com/C-Dev-Connect/events/223514346/ Does that count? On 10 September 2015 at 11:13, Paul Nijjar wrote: > > Does anybody have something to offer for the second half of Monday's > meeting? > > Would anybody be interested in a roundtable on supporting new Linux > users? > > (also if there are FLOSSy events for Sept you want me to publicize on > -announce please submit them to me. I have a few already: Maker Expo, > the CitizenFour screening, and Stephen Paul Weber's crowdfunding > campaign) > > > - Paul > > > http://pnijjar.freeshell.org > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Thu Sep 10 14:03:22 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2015 14:03:22 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Last call In-Reply-To: References: <20150910151345.GA3765@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: <20150910180322.GB3784@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Sure, I guess. I don't want to advertise everything on the Watcamp calendar, but if there are specific items of interest then they probably count (modulo my capricious judgement). - Paul On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 01:31:55PM -0400, Chris Craig wrote: > C# Dev/Connect is having a talk on C# in Linux on Tuesday, 2015-09-15 at 7pm > > http://www.meetup.com/C-Dev-Connect/events/223514346/ > > Does that count? > From kb at 2bits.com Sat Sep 12 13:37:45 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2015 13:37:45 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: There is now a campaign to persuade the FCC to reverse their stance on locking router firmware, which will prevent people from flashing their own OpenWRT, DD-WRT, Tomato, ...etc. https://libreplanet.org/wiki/Save_WiFi On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 4:02 PM, Paul Nijjar wrote: > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 06:01:59PM -0400, Joseph Wennechuk wrote: >> http://www.itsmypart.com/fcc-rules-block-use-of-open-source/ > > I'm glad they linked to Doctorow's piece. He called this exactly. > > I am much less sanguine than Chris is about this. > > -- > http://pnijjar.freeshell.org > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From kb at 2bits.com Sat Sep 12 13:42:45 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2015 13:42:45 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] New stable release of OpenWRT 15.05 Message-ID: Just released yesterday. https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?pid=291233 The only thing that is painful about OpenWRT upgrades, is that you have to keep track of what extra packages you installed. You then upgrade the firmware (which wipes all packages), then you install all those packages from scratch. Lots of work. -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Sat Sep 12 14:12:38 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2015 18:12:38 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] New stable release of OpenWRT 15.05 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: hmm.. " bcm53xx: basic Netgear R7000 support & R8000 image" could it be I can finally flash my netgear ac1900? On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 at 13:47 Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > Just released yesterday. > > https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?pid=291233 > > The only thing that is painful about OpenWRT upgrades, is that you > have to keep track of what extra packages you installed. You then > upgrade the firmware (which wipes all packages), then you install all > those packages from scratch. Lots of work. > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bjonkman at sobac.com Sat Sep 12 15:12:58 2015 From: bjonkman at sobac.com (Bob Jonkman) Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2015 15:12:58 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: References: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Whatever DRM is applied to routers &c, someone will crack it soon enough, OpenWRT, DD-WRT and Tomato will all work again, and then we all become criminals. - --Bob. Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! On 12/09/15 01:37 PM, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > There is now a campaign to persuade the FCC to reverse their stance > on locking router firmware, which will prevent people from flashing > their own OpenWRT, DD-WRT, Tomato, ...etc. > > https://libreplanet.org/wiki/Save_WiFi > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 4:02 PM, Paul Nijjar > wrote: >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 06:01:59PM -0400, Joseph Wennechuk >> wrote: >>> http://www.itsmypart.com/fcc-rules-block-use-of-open-source/ >> >> I'm glad they linked to Doctorow's piece. He called this >> exactly. >> >> I am much less sanguine than Chris is about this. >> >> -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc >> mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability iEYEARECAAYFAlX0eTcACgkQuRKJsNLM5eoS5ACfd5OXG7h23jaH7b++q/4ngSiT 5O8AoPhpztduri4KkmZm/I7/IdJsuCQ5 =yyrv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From raymondchen625 at gmail.com Mon Sep 14 09:17:04 2015 From: raymondchen625 at gmail.com (Raymond Chen) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 09:17:04 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com> References: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com> Message-ID: What's the purpose of this lockdown? To prevent individual from flashing? It sounds like Jailbreak on iPhone. If the manufacturers make their devices good enough, most users won't bother to flash. On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 3:12 PM, Bob Jonkman wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Whatever DRM is applied to routers &c, someone will crack it soon > enough, OpenWRT, DD-WRT and Tomato will all work again, and then we > all become criminals. > > - --Bob. > > Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 > Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga > https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca > Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! > > > On 12/09/15 01:37 PM, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > > There is now a campaign to persuade the FCC to reverse their stance > > on locking router firmware, which will prevent people from flashing > > their own OpenWRT, DD-WRT, Tomato, ...etc. > > > > https://libreplanet.org/wiki/Save_WiFi > > > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 4:02 PM, Paul Nijjar > > wrote: > >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 06:01:59PM -0400, Joseph Wennechuk > >> wrote: > >>> http://www.itsmypart.com/fcc-rules-block-use-of-open-source/ > >> > >> I'm glad they linked to Doctorow's piece. He called this > >> exactly. > >> > >> I am much less sanguine than Chris is about this. > >> > >> -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc > >> mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > >> > > > > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability > > iEYEARECAAYFAlX0eTcACgkQuRKJsNLM5eoS5ACfd5OXG7h23jaH7b++q/4ngSiT > 5O8AoPhpztduri4KkmZm/I7/IdJsuCQ5 > =yyrv > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aklists at mixdown.ca Mon Sep 14 09:31:18 2015 From: aklists at mixdown.ca (Andrew Kohlsmith (mailing lists account)) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 09:31:18 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: References: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com> Message-ID: <21992581-1123-48CF-BA58-CD81604D5F83@mixdown.ca> > On Sep 14, 2015, at 9:17 AM, Raymond Chen wrote: > What's the purpose of this lockdown? To prevent individual from flashing? It sounds like Jailbreak on iPhone. If the manufacturers make their devices good enough, most users won't bother to flash. It?s being blown out of proportion, but not without reason. The FCC is stating they want the radio controllers to be un-changeable by end users. They want to ensure you can?t ?open up? your radio channel allocation to use frequencies that are not allowed in the US (think of 2.4GHz wifi channels 13 and 14), or to screw with your amplifier settings. These are good things to keep the average user from tinkering with. As a hardcore tinkerer and hacker, I agree with their rule. In fact, almost every cell phone already implements this by nature of having a radio processor that is completely separate from the application processor. The problem, though, is that the way things are these days and the way they are heading is to incorporate more and more of the radio software in with the processor that also runs the firmware most people are familiar with (the ?operating system? that DD-WRT, etc. replace). SoCs (Systems on Chip) blur the line between what is radio and what is application and the firmware images also become blurred, allowing the possibility for tinkerers to muck with things they should not. Take these two facts and combine them with the ?simplest, stupidest, cheapest way possible? way that most manufacturers will implement this proposed requirement and it?s VERY possible we will end up with wireless devices that we can?t replace the firmware on. Sure, they?ll implement the protection poorly, but that?s not the point. We should be free to replace the firmware on devices we own. We should be able to screw with the hardware so long as we don?t violate FCC requirements which are there for good reason. iPhone jailbreaking is more about Apple maintaining their iron grip on the user experience of their devices. The FCC proposal has merit. It?s the implementation we (or at least I) am worried about. -A. From raymondchen625 at gmail.com Mon Sep 14 10:31:36 2015 From: raymondchen625 at gmail.com (Raymond Chen) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 10:31:36 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: <21992581-1123-48CF-BA58-CD81604D5F83@mixdown.ca> References: <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com> <21992581-1123-48CF-BA58-CD81604D5F83@mixdown.ca> Message-ID: Great explanation. Thanks Andrew. I agree that we should not be allowed to mess up with the frequencies, at least not without some reasonable constraints. Other than that, we should be allowed to change our own hardware anyway we want. On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 9:31 AM, Andrew Kohlsmith (mailing lists account) < aklists at mixdown.ca> wrote: > > On Sep 14, 2015, at 9:17 AM, Raymond Chen > wrote: > > What's the purpose of this lockdown? To prevent individual from > flashing? It sounds like Jailbreak on iPhone. If the manufacturers make > their devices good enough, most users won't bother to flash. > > It?s being blown out of proportion, but not without reason. > > The FCC is stating they want the radio controllers to be un-changeable by > end users. They want to ensure you can?t ?open up? your radio channel > allocation to use frequencies that are not allowed in the US (think of > 2.4GHz wifi channels 13 and 14), or to screw with your amplifier settings. > These are good things to keep the average user from tinkering with. As a > hardcore tinkerer and hacker, I agree with their rule. In fact, almost > every cell phone already implements this by nature of having a radio > processor that is completely separate from the application processor. > > The problem, though, is that the way things are these days and the way > they are heading is to incorporate more and more of the radio software in > with the processor that also runs the firmware most people are familiar > with (the ?operating system? that DD-WRT, etc. replace). SoCs (Systems on > Chip) blur the line between what is radio and what is application and the > firmware images also become blurred, allowing the possibility for tinkerers > to muck with things they should not. > > Take these two facts and combine them with the ?simplest, stupidest, > cheapest way possible? way that most manufacturers will implement this > proposed requirement and it?s VERY possible we will end up with wireless > devices that we can?t replace the firmware on. > > Sure, they?ll implement the protection poorly, but that?s not the point. > We should be free to replace the firmware on devices we own. We should be > able to screw with the hardware so long as we don?t violate FCC > requirements which are there for good reason. > > iPhone jailbreaking is more about Apple maintaining their iron grip on the > user experience of their devices. The FCC proposal has merit. It?s the > implementation we (or at least I) am worried about. > > -A. > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kb at 2bits.com Mon Sep 14 21:50:56 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 21:50:56 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Backup verification using cpio Message-ID: The cpio tool provides a way for verifying backups, but it is a two-pass thing and a prerequisite. For this to work, you have to use the "crc" output format for the archive: cpio -o -H crc .... > archive cpio -i --only-verify-crc < archive >From the manual for this last option: "When reading a CRC format archive, only verify the CRC?s of each file in the archive, don?t actually extract the files" cpio is more complicated than tar and has a multitude of output formats, and that is probably why it never caught on like tar. -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From kb at 2bits.com Mon Sep 14 22:05:44 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 22:05:44 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Windows 10 spying scares regular users Message-ID: Here is my post about Windows 10 spying. The link to the video is at the bottom. Look at the reactions from those commenting, most of whom are non-techies. https://www.facebook.com/kbahey/posts/10152981300237751 -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From kb at 2bits.com Mon Sep 14 23:19:41 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 23:19:41 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk Message-ID: Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can get the PDF from here: http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From ldpaniak at fourpisolutions.com Tue Sep 15 07:19:52 2015 From: ldpaniak at fourpisolutions.com (L.D. Paniak) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 07:19:52 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Windows 10 spying scares regular users In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <55F7FED8.4050608@fourpisolutions.com> Interestingly, I get "video has been removed by user"... Are there other examples? On 09/14/2015 10:05 PM, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > Here is my post about Windows 10 spying. > > The link to the video is at the bottom. > > Look at the reactions from those commenting, most of whom are non-techies. > > https://www.facebook.com/kbahey/posts/10152981300237751 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 473 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From 143news at gmail.com Tue Sep 15 09:10:25 2015 From: 143news at gmail.com (Dan Hergott) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 09:10:25 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I try accessing the file but get an error. On Sep 14, 2015 11:22 PM, "Khalid Baheyeldin" wrote: > Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can > get the PDF from here: > > > http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html > > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mpurvis at clearpathrobotics.com Tue Sep 15 09:12:41 2015 From: mpurvis at clearpathrobotics.com (Mike Purvis) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 09:12:41 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Backup verification using cpio In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: cpio archives can be trivially appended to? one place that this is really nice is for overlaying a preseed file onto a debian-installer FS image. Mike On 14 September 2015 at 21:50, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > The cpio tool provides a way for verifying backups, but it is a > two-pass thing and a prerequisite. > > For this to work, you have to use the "crc" output format for the archive: > > cpio -o -H crc .... > archive > > cpio -i --only-verify-crc < archive > > From the manual for this last option: "When reading a CRC format > archive, only verify the CRC?s of each file in the archive, don?t > actually extract the files" > > cpio is more complicated than tar and has a multitude of output > formats, and that is probably why it never caught on like tar. > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kb at 2bits.com Tue Sep 15 09:31:25 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 09:31:25 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: When I click on the PDF link, it opens normally for me. On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:10 AM, Dan Hergott <143news at gmail.com> wrote: > I try accessing the file but get an error. > > On Sep 14, 2015 11:22 PM, "Khalid Baheyeldin" wrote: >> >> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can >> get the PDF from here: >> >> >> http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html >> >> -- >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin >> 2bits.com, Inc. >> Fast Reliable Drupal >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 15 09:37:38 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 13:37:38 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I get nastiness right on the html link you provided in the first message: Home Error 403: Access Denied Sponsored Links You do not have permission to access the requested page. Here is what you can do: - You could have mis-spelled the URL of the page you want. If all of the above does not work, then please contact us with details of what you were trying to do. I'm running Chrome 45.0.2454.85 m on my work Windows 7 box, with a PIA VPN tunnel. On Tue, 15 Sep 2015 at 09:33 Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > When I click on the PDF link, it opens normally for me. > > > On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:10 AM, Dan Hergott <143news at gmail.com> wrote: > > I try accessing the file but get an error. > > > > On Sep 14, 2015 11:22 PM, "Khalid Baheyeldin" wrote: > >> > >> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can > >> get the PDF from here: > >> > >> > >> > http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html > >> > >> -- > >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin > >> 2bits.com, Inc. > >> Fast Reliable Drupal > >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> kwlug-disc mailing list > >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kwlug-disc mailing list > > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > > > > > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kb at 2bits.com Tue Sep 15 09:54:52 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 09:54:52 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: OK, that is different. Fixed. Please try now. On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:37 AM, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > I get nastiness right on the html link you provided in the first message: > > Home > > Error 403: Access Denied > > Sponsored Links > > You do not have permission to access the requested page. > > Here is what you can do: > > You could have mis-spelled the URL of the page you want. > > If all of the above does not work, then please contact us with details of > what you were trying to do. > > > I'm running Chrome 45.0.2454.85 m on my work Windows 7 box, with a PIA VPN > tunnel. > > > > On Tue, 15 Sep 2015 at 09:33 Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: >> >> When I click on the PDF link, it opens normally for me. >> >> >> On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:10 AM, Dan Hergott <143news at gmail.com> wrote: >> > I try accessing the file but get an error. >> > >> > On Sep 14, 2015 11:22 PM, "Khalid Baheyeldin" wrote: >> >> >> >> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can >> >> get the PDF from here: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin >> >> 2bits.com, Inc. >> >> Fast Reliable Drupal >> >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. >> >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra >> >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci >> >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, >> >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> >> >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > kwlug-disc mailing list >> > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin >> 2bits.com, Inc. >> Fast Reliable Drupal >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 15 10:00:33 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 14:00:33 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Confirm fixed.. and I can open the PDF with no problems. On Tue, 15 Sep 2015 at 09:57 Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > OK, that is different. > > Fixed. > > Please try now. > > On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:37 AM, CrankyOldBugger > wrote: > > I get nastiness right on the html link you provided in the first message: > > > > Home > > > > Error 403: Access Denied > > > > Sponsored Links > > > > You do not have permission to access the requested page. > > > > Here is what you can do: > > > > You could have mis-spelled the URL of the page you want. > > > > If all of the above does not work, then please contact us with details of > > what you were trying to do. > > > > > > I'm running Chrome 45.0.2454.85 m on my work Windows 7 box, with a PIA > VPN > > tunnel. > > > > > > > > On Tue, 15 Sep 2015 at 09:33 Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > >> > >> When I click on the PDF link, it opens normally for me. > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 9:10 AM, Dan Hergott <143news at gmail.com> wrote: > >> > I try accessing the file but get an error. > >> > > >> > On Sep 14, 2015 11:22 PM, "Khalid Baheyeldin" wrote: > >> >> > >> >> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can > >> >> get the PDF from here: > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin > >> >> 2bits.com, Inc. > >> >> Fast Reliable Drupal > >> >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > >> >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > >> >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > >> >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > >> >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> kwlug-disc mailing list > >> >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >> >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > >> >> > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > kwlug-disc mailing list > >> > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >> > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Khalid M. Baheyeldin > >> 2bits.com, Inc. > >> Fast Reliable Drupal > >> Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > >> Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > >> Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > >> For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > >> and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> kwlug-disc mailing list > >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kwlug-disc mailing list > > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > > > > > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kb at 2bits.com Tue Sep 15 10:17:55 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 10:17:55 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Windows 10 spying scares regular users In-Reply-To: <55F7FED8.4050608@fourpisolutions.com> References: <55F7FED8.4050608@fourpisolutions.com> Message-ID: Hmm ... odd. Was he contacted by someone to remove it? Here is another article that linked to the same video: http://investmentwatchblog.com/any-windows-10-device-no-matter-what-users-do-will-be-sending-encrypted-telemetry-to-redmond-every-time-they-open-or-close-any-locally-stored-image-file/ There is this article based on some Czech guy's work. http://localghost.org/posts/a-traffic-analysis-of-windows-10 Others are saying the Czech site is known for pro-Russian propaganda https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10099180 Some of the claims are refuted here: http://blog.robseder.com/2015/08/16/whats-the-real-deal-with-windows-10-and-privacy/ Ars Technica UK also observed data being sent even when telemetry was told not to. http://arstechnica.co.uk/information-technology/2015/08/even-when-told-not-to-windows-10-just-cant-stop-talking-to-microsoft/ And here is a video on that Ars article: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOZ-mwaDhlo On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 7:19 AM, L.D. Paniak wrote: > Interestingly, I get "video has been removed by user"... > Are there other examples? > > On 09/14/2015 10:05 PM, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: >> Here is my post about Windows 10 spying. >> >> The link to the video is at the bottom. >> >> Look at the reactions from those commenting, most of whom are non-techies. >> >> https://www.facebook.com/kbahey/posts/10152981300237751 > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Tue Sep 15 11:43:57 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (Jeff Smith) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 11:43:57 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source In-Reply-To: References: , <20150831200252.GB3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org>, , <55F4793A.5090101@sobac.com>, , <21992581-1123-48CF-BA58-CD81604D5F83@mixdown.ca>, Message-ID: How should we feel about the recent attacks against routers around the world, as mentioned here: http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/synful-knock-router-malware-1.3228732?cmp=rss If routers are the new target, then I would like the option of updating my router's open-source firmware quickly, instead of waiting for a proprietary firmware release weeks later... Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 10:31:36 -0400 From: raymondchen625 at gmail.com To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] FCC Rules Block use of Open Source Great explanation. Thanks Andrew. I agree that we should not be allowed to mess up with the frequencies, at least not without some reasonable constraints. Other than that, we should be allowed to change our own hardware anyway we want. On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 9:31 AM, Andrew Kohlsmith (mailing lists account) wrote: > On Sep 14, 2015, at 9:17 AM, Raymond Chen wrote: > What's the purpose of this lockdown? To prevent individual from flashing? It sounds like Jailbreak on iPhone. If the manufacturers make their devices good enough, most users won't bother to flash. It?s being blown out of proportion, but not without reason. The FCC is stating they want the radio controllers to be un-changeable by end users. They want to ensure you can?t ?open up? your radio channel allocation to use frequencies that are not allowed in the US (think of 2.4GHz wifi channels 13 and 14), or to screw with your amplifier settings. These are good things to keep the average user from tinkering with. As a hardcore tinkerer and hacker, I agree with their rule. In fact, almost every cell phone already implements this by nature of having a radio processor that is completely separate from the application processor. The problem, though, is that the way things are these days and the way they are heading is to incorporate more and more of the radio software in with the processor that also runs the firmware most people are familiar with (the ?operating system? that DD-WRT, etc. replace). SoCs (Systems on Chip) blur the line between what is radio and what is application and the firmware images also become blurred, allowing the possibility for tinkerers to muck with things they should not. Take these two facts and combine them with the ?simplest, stupidest, cheapest way possible? way that most manufacturers will implement this proposed requirement and it?s VERY possible we will end up with wireless devices that we can?t replace the firmware on. Sure, they?ll implement the protection poorly, but that?s not the point. We should be free to replace the firmware on devices we own. We should be able to screw with the hardware so long as we don?t violate FCC requirements which are there for good reason. iPhone jailbreaking is more about Apple maintaining their iron grip on the user experience of their devices. The FCC proposal has merit. It?s the implementation we (or at least I) am worried about. -A. _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From 143news at gmail.com Tue Sep 15 20:46:25 2015 From: 143news at gmail.com (Dan Hergott's news account) Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2015 20:46:25 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <55F8BBE1.5040307@gmail.com> On 09/15/2015 09:31 AM, Khalid Baheyeldin wrote: > When I click on the PDF link, it opens normally for me. > It works now for me now as well, thanks. Dan. From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Wed Sep 16 11:04:15 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 15:04:15 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] 'Let's Encrypt' free encryption project issues first SSL/TLS certificate Message-ID: http://www.pcworld.com/article/2984251/security/encryption-project-issues-first-free-ssl-tls-certificate.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hubert at uhoreg.ca Wed Sep 16 13:20:53 2015 From: hubert at uhoreg.ca (Hubert Chathi) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 13:20:53 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: (Khalid Baheyeldin's message of "Mon, 14 Sep 2015 23:19:41 -0400") References: Message-ID: <87a8smi8lm.fsf@desiato.home.uhoreg.ca> On Mon, 14 Sep 2015 23:19:41 -0400, Khalid Baheyeldin said: > Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can > get the PDF from here: > http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html I missed the presentation so you may have addressed this, but why are you using cpio instead of just cp -a? From kb at 2bits.com Wed Sep 16 13:36:42 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 13:36:42 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: <87a8smi8lm.fsf@desiato.home.uhoreg.ca> References: <87a8smi8lm.fsf@desiato.home.uhoreg.ca> Message-ID: Several reasons: cpio will copy all special files, and the -0 (together with find -print0) will handle all files with weird characters in their names (even a newline). Also, cpio -a resets the access time of the files back to what it is, so the files are not considered any fresher than they actually are. I am told that rsync is also another way of doing the same, and has checksums per file (Lori can chime in on this). On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Hubert Chathi wrote: > On Mon, 14 Sep 2015 23:19:41 -0400, Khalid Baheyeldin said: > >> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can >> get the PDF from here: > >> http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html > > I missed the presentation so you may have addressed this, but why are > you using cpio instead of just cp -a? > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Wed Sep 16 16:54:13 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 20:54:13 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1336896035.602995.1442436853805.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> > Also, cpio -a resets He said cp, not cpio. Rsync only does checksums when run as a daemon. e.g. rsync /fromhere tothere::/dest <- note the double colon, meaning daemon mode. Else it's a local copy and checksumming is not done. e.g. Mount a samba share and rsync /fromhere /mnt/tothere/dest/dir IIRC, rsync /fromhere tothere:/dest would be an NFS destination, so also not checksummed. (There has to be something running on the other end to calculate the received checksum.) mondoarchive, however, accomplishes all that you say in your message. Including the generation of a boot cd. For what it's worth. Also, arguably, btrfs takes you to the same place (self-checksumming), throwing an error if there is one. Giving you a chance to repair the single file issue (as you also accomplish), but in place. Not arguing with you, I get you were presenting your experiences and your particular (eventually) successful resolution to the problem at hand / in front of you you were trying to solve at the time. ----- Original Message ----- > From: Khalid Baheyeldin > To: KWLUG discussion > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2015 1:36 PM > Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk > > Several reasons: > > cpio will copy all special files, and the -0 (together with find > -print0) will handle all files with weird characters in their names > (even a newline). > > Also, cpio -a resets the access time of the files back to what it is, > so the files are not considered any fresher than they actually are. > > I am told that rsync is also another way of doing the same, and has > checksums per file (Lori can chime in on this). > > On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Hubert Chathi wrote: >> On Mon, 14 Sep 2015 23:19:41 -0400, Khalid Baheyeldin > said: >> >>> Those who want more information on my presentation tonight, you can >>> get the PDF from here: >> >>> > http://baheyeldin.com/articles/linux/presentation-replacing-laptop-disk-linux.html >> >> I missed the presentation so you may have addressed this, but why are >> you using cpio instead of just cp -a? >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kwlug-disc mailing list >> kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >> http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org >> > > > > -- > Khalid M. Baheyeldin > 2bits.com, Inc. > Fast Reliable Drupal > Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. > Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra > Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci > For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, > and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken > > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > From kb at 2bits.com Wed Sep 16 16:59:47 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 16:59:47 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: <1336896035.602995.1442436853805.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1336896035.602995.1442436853805.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 4:54 PM, B.S. wrote: >> Also, cpio -a resets > > He said cp, not cpio. I know. What I am saying is that with cpio and its -a option, you leave the file system is the state it was in (access times not update). -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Wed Sep 16 17:05:47 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 21:05:47 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1878264368.575234.1442437547950.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Right, but his question was not why 'cpio -a' but how does 'cp -a' not take you to the same place? (Per man cp "preserve the specified attributes (default: mode,ownership,timestamps), if possible additional attributes: context, links, xattr, all") ----- Original Message ----- > From: Khalid Baheyeldin > To: KWLUG discussion > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2015 4:59 PM > Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk > > On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 4:54 PM, B.S. wrote: >>> Also, cpio -a resets >> >> He said cp, not cpio. > > I know. > > What I am saying is that with cpio and its -a option, you leave the > file system is the state it was in (access times not update). From kb at 2bits.com Wed Sep 16 17:25:58 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 17:25:58 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: <1878264368.575234.1442437547950.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1878264368.575234.1442437547950.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: And I answered his question. To clarify: cp -a copies as you quoted from the manual. But the source file would have its access time updated to now, rather than when the file was last really accessed. Think of a file that you did not read for 4 years. Now it says it was read today. cpio -a avoids that by resetting the last access time of the files it copies. In the case of replacing an ailing hard disk, this is not a big deal, since it will be junked. Also, many systems now run with noatime as a filesystem level option, meaning the last access time is not updated. The other reason for cpio is copying special files and files with funny characters in their names. On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 5:05 PM, B.S. wrote: > Right, but his question was not why 'cpio -a' but how does 'cp -a' not take you to the same place? > > (Per man cp "preserve the specified attributes (default: mode,ownership,timestamps), if possible additional attributes: context, links, xattr, all") > > ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Khalid Baheyeldin >> To: KWLUG discussion >> Cc: >> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2015 4:59 PM >> Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk >> >> On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 4:54 PM, B.S. wrote: >>>> Also, cpio -a resets >>> >>> He said cp, not cpio. >> >> I know. >> >> What I am saying is that with cpio and its -a option, you leave the >> file system is the state it was in (access times not update). > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Wed Sep 16 18:36:34 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 22:36:34 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1753440722.650455.1442442994344.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> ----- Original Message ----- > From: Khalid Baheyeldin > To: KWLUG discussion > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2015 5:25 PM > Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Presentation: replacing a laptop's hard disk > > And I answered his question. > > To clarify: > > cp -a copies as you quoted from the manual. But the source file would > have its access time updated to now, rather than when the file was > last really accessed. Perfect. That's the D'oh! From youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com Fri Sep 18 21:31:45 2015 From: youcanreachmehere at Hotmail.com (Joseph Wennechuk) Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2015 21:31:45 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Microsoft launches a Linux powered operating system - Linux Veda Message-ID: Anyone have more details, thoughts, comments on this? http://www.linuxveda.com/2015/09/18/microsoft-launches-a-linux-powered-operating-system/?utm_campaign=shareaholic&utm_medium=reddit&utm_source=news -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Fri Sep 18 21:46:30 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2015 01:46:30 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Microsoft launches a Linux powered operating system - Linux Veda In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1254611603.62582.1442627190577.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Interesting. Thank you for the link. MS going after Red Hat's, SuSe's, and hardware vendor's lunch? The article notes: "We don?t yet know when and if Microsoft will release the source code of the project and which licence they will use for it; the Linux kernel is licenced under GNU GPLv2, so it has to be a compatible licence." Is that entirely true? I get if they link in / copy source, but if I download, say, a driver or other software from a 3rd party after the fact (of install), does the GPL (one must make source code available) apply? (vs, say, just call, or use APIs?) Guess maybe it must be, else they must provide binaries for every possibility. Maybe not - hardware vendors only warrant on certain OS's, e.g. RHEL not CentOS. Hmmm. [To be fair ... upon reading Joe's message I had to make sure the date wasn't April 1.] >________________________________ > From: Joseph Wennechuk >To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >Sent: Friday, September 18, 2015 9:31 PM >Subject: [kwlug-disc] Microsoft launches a Linux powered operating system - Linux Veda > > > > >Anyone have more details, thoughts, comments on this? > >http://www.linuxveda.com/2015/09/18/microsoft-launches-a-linux-powered-operating-system From jpoole at digitaljedi.ca Fri Sep 18 22:04:12 2015 From: jpoole at digitaljedi.ca (=?utf-8?Q?Jonathan_Poole?=) Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2015 02:04:12 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Microsoft launches a Linux powered operating system - Linux Veda In-Reply-To: <1254611603.62582.1442627190577.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <0000014fe35831db-f975b9e8-0742-43d8-8135-fd15de1d3652-000000@email.amazonses.com> Perhaps it's the networking OS for the azure switch.? http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/09/18/microsoft_has_developed_its_own_linux_repeat_microsoft_has_developed_its_own_linux Sent from my iPhone On Sep 18, 2015, at 9:47 PM, B.S. > wrote: Interesting. Thank you for the link. MS going after Red Hat's, SuSe's, and hardware vendor's lunch? The article notes: "We don?t yet know when and if Microsoft will release the source code of the project and which licence they will use for it; the Linux kernel is licenced under GNU GPLv2, so it has to be a compatible licence." Is that entirely true? I get if they link in / copy source, but if I download, say, a driver or other software from a 3rd party after the fact (of install), does the GPL (one must make source code available) apply? (vs, say, just call, or use APIs?) Guess maybe it must be, else they must provide binaries for every possibility. Maybe not - hardware vendors only warrant on certain OS's, e.g. RHEL not CentOS. Hmmm. [To be fair ... upon reading Joe's message I had to make sure the date wasn't April 1.] >________________________________ > From: Joseph Wennechuk > >To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org >Sent: Friday, September 18, 2015 9:31 PM >Subject: [kwlug-disc] Microsoft launches a Linux powered operating system -??? Linux Veda > > > > >Anyone have more details, thoughts, comments on this? > >http://www.linuxveda.com/2015/09/18/microsoft-launches-a-linux-powered-operating-system _______________________________________________ kwlug-disc mailing list kwlug-disc at kwlug.org http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Sun Sep 20 22:36:22 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 22:36:22 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- how to backup BTRFS to another BTRFS? Message-ID: <20150921023622.GA4893@node1.localdomain> To BTRFS experts, I'm currently using BTRFS as on-line backup, and I'm getting used to its snapshot capability. Now, I would like to backup it to another BTRFS disk and pull it out for off-line backup. I can't use 'rsync' for this, because it doesn't understand BTRFS snapshot and subvolume, and will only copy as directories/files. How do you backup up one BTRFS to another BTRFS? Manual says something about "send" and "receive". Are those right keywords to search for? -- William From ldpaniak at fourpisolutions.com Sun Sep 20 22:54:24 2015 From: ldpaniak at fourpisolutions.com (L.D. Paniak) Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 22:54:24 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- how to backup BTRFS to another BTRFS? In-Reply-To: <20150921023622.GA4893@node1.localdomain> References: <20150921023622.GA4893@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <55FF7160.3050008@fourpisolutions.com> Yes, send and receive are the terms to look for. https://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Incremental_Backup looks like a good place to start... On 09/20/2015 10:36 PM, William Park wrote: > To BTRFS experts, > > I'm currently using BTRFS as on-line backup, and I'm getting used to its > snapshot capability. Now, I would like to backup it to another BTRFS > disk and pull it out for off-line backup. I can't use 'rsync' for this, > because it doesn't understand BTRFS snapshot and subvolume, and will > only copy as directories/files. > > How do you backup up one BTRFS to another BTRFS? Manual says something > about "send" and "receive". Are those right keywords to search for? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 473 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From chaslinux at gmail.com Mon Sep 21 17:17:36 2015 From: chaslinux at gmail.com (Charles M) Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2015 17:17:36 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA Message-ID: Wondering if others in the list have transferred large amounts of data over internal SATA to SATA? I'm transferring approximately 768GB of data between two drives (2TB and 3TB) and getting an average of 83MB/s according to midnight commander). Reading some other threads it seems pretty good (one thread talked about getting only 20MB/s) but I haven't done a lot of local data transfer so I don't know what's a good speed. The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not sure if an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket FM2+), but if it would double the speed I would probably spring for it. Right now the transfer is 55% done with 1 hour and 13 minutes left. I should mention I'm remotely connected to the system, but I doubt this will have any effect since it's just transferring to the drive on the same remote system. Cheers, Charles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kb at 2bits.com Mon Sep 21 18:06:42 2015 From: kb at 2bits.com (Khalid Baheyeldin) Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2015 18:06:42 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: USB transfer is around 20MB/seconds. So, 83MB/s is much better. For one project I tried an SSD, and it did not offer any improved performance over spinning platters. The bottleneck seemed to be the SATA interface itself, not doing reads and writes in parallel. On Mon, Sep 21, 2015 at 5:17 PM, Charles M wrote: > Wondering if others in the list have transferred large amounts of data over > internal SATA to SATA? I'm transferring approximately 768GB of data between > two drives (2TB and 3TB) and getting an average of 83MB/s according to > midnight commander). Reading some other threads it seems pretty good (one > thread talked about getting only 20MB/s) but I haven't done a lot of local > data transfer so I don't know what's a good speed. > > The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not sure if > an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket FM2+), but if > it would double the speed I would probably spring for it. Right now the > transfer is 55% done with 1 hour and 13 minutes left. I should mention I'm > remotely connected to the system, but I doubt this will have any effect > since it's just transferring to the drive on the same remote system. > > Cheers, > > Charles > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > -- Khalid M. Baheyeldin 2bits.com, Inc. Fast Reliable Drupal Drupal optimization, development, customization and consulting. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability. -- Edsger W.Dijkstra Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci For every complex problem, there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H.L. Mencken From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Mon Sep 21 22:50:05 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2015 22:50:05 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150922025005.GA9976@node1.localdomain> On Mon, Sep 21, 2015 at 05:17:36PM -0400, Charles M wrote: > Wondering if others in the list have transferred large amounts of data over > internal SATA to SATA? I'm transferring approximately 768GB of data between > two drives (2TB and 3TB) and getting an average of 83MB/s according to That's about right for SATA. Read speed for harddisk can be fast, but only for those in-line sectors as disk rotates. Once the head moves, who knows where it goes. Also, there is difference between 'dd' kind of read/write and 'cp' kind of read/write. > midnight commander). Reading some other threads it seems pretty good (one > thread talked about getting only 20MB/s) but I haven't done a lot of local > data transfer so I don't know what's a good speed. > > The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not sure if > an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket FM2+), but if Forget AMD. Go with Intel. > it would double the speed I would probably spring for it. Right now the > transfer is 55% done with 1 hour and 13 minutes left. I should mention I'm > remotely connected to the system, but I doubt this will have any effect > since it's just transferring to the drive on the same remote system. > > Cheers, > > Charles > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org From aklists at mixdown.ca Mon Sep 21 23:23:25 2015 From: aklists at mixdown.ca (Andrew Kohlsmith (mailing lists account)) Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2015 23:23:25 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA In-Reply-To: <20150922025005.GA9976@node1.localdomain> References: <20150922025005.GA9976@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: > On Sep 21, 2015, at 10:50 PM, William Park wrote: >> The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not sure if >> an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket FM2+), but if > > Forget AMD. Go with Intel. While I too prefer Intel over AMD, I don?t think the CPU is actually doing much to help or hinder the transfers. Everything will be DMA?d from one buffer to another, with the CPU just minding the transfers and waiting for them to complete. If the buffering is set up poorly or the driver is interrupting after every block or something stupid like that it can certainly cause transfers between fast drives to be slow, but a fast CPU would punk out just as much as a slower one. 660Mbit/sec seems awfully slow to me, even for random writes on spinning rust. Almost every SATA driver takes advantage of elevator sorting and bursting, even with random writes. -A. From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Tue Sep 22 05:06:45 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2015 05:06:45 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA In-Reply-To: References: <20150922025005.GA9976@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <20150922090645.GA11597@node1.localdomain> On Mon, Sep 21, 2015 at 11:23:25PM -0400, Andrew Kohlsmith (mailing lists account) wrote: > > On Sep 21, 2015, at 10:50 PM, William Park wrote: > >> The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not sure if > >> an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket FM2+), but if > > > > Forget AMD. Go with Intel. > > While I too prefer Intel over AMD, I don???t think the CPU is actually > doing much to help or hinder the transfers. Everything will be DMA???d > from one buffer to another, with the CPU just minding the transfers > and waiting for them to complete. Yes, when I said "Intel", I meant Intel cpu, chipset, and motherboards are better. I had AMD 8-core 125W system, and it would choke when doing any IO. The cpu/memory bandwidth was ok, judging by kernel compile times. I replaced it with i3, because I could no longer afford electricity. -- William From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Tue Sep 22 11:59:01 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2015 15:59:01 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- how to backup BTRFS to another BTRFS? In-Reply-To: <55FF7160.3050008@fourpisolutions.com> References: <55FF7160.3050008@fourpisolutions.com> Message-ID: <2118765692.1578460.1442937541423.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> As of today, that link is now also within https://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/UseCases#How_can_I_use_btrfs_for_backups.2Ftime-machine.3F It mentions other options as well, if useful: Snapper btrfs-time-machine UrBackup rsyncbtrfs And some further proposed options. ----- Original Message ----- > From: L.D. Paniak > To: KWLUG discussion > Cc: > Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2015 10:54 PM > Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] question -- how to backup BTRFS to another BTRFS? > > Yes, send and receive are the terms to look for. > > https://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Incremental_Backup > looks like a good place to start... > > > On 09/20/2015 10:36 PM, William Park wrote: >> To BTRFS experts, >> >> I'm currently using BTRFS as on-line backup, and I'm getting used > to its >> snapshot capability. Now, I would like to backup it to another BTRFS >> disk and pull it out for off-line backup. I can't use 'rsync' > for this, >> because it doesn't understand BTRFS snapshot and subvolume, and will >> only copy as directories/files. >> >> How do you backup up one BTRFS to another BTRFS? Manual says something >> about "send" and "receive". Are those right keywords > to search for? From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Tue Sep 22 12:27:40 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2015 16:27:40 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA In-Reply-To: <20150922090645.GA11597@node1.localdomain> References: <20150922090645.GA11597@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <1346633302.1632337.1442939260123.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> I don't expect it has so much to do with the CPU as the associated south bridge, the beastie handling the mass storage connectivity. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southbridge_(computing) The CPU association is common though ... can't exactly put an Intel Southbridge on an AMD CPU, I expect. As for speed, make sure everything in the chain is SATA III, I suppose, and I expect being on different controllers will help. e.g. My motherboard has both the 'stock' sata connections that come with the intel cpu and another onboard controller. There are PCIe cards at Canada Computers for under $50 - assuming you're not loading up the bus otherwise at the time. Can't say how significant, if any, separate controllers would bring to the party, but I expect it would have to be some. No doubt not interrupting the I/O will help, but as noted presumably peeking at things (remotely) is only a blip in the duration. iotop should show you the copy as being the only thing beating the i/o to death. If this is one off, probably not worth a further investment. If it isn't, you're going to want the backup on different hardware, and at that point net i/o will be the bottleneck, not the local hardware itself. Even a PIII can probably keep up with SATA II over a gigabit network, writing even. Run overnight, whether it takes 5 minutes or 15 to finish a backup probably won't matter to you. I thought SATA IV was coming, but looks like it's only up to 3.2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA#SATA_revision_3.2_.2816_Gbit.2Fs.2C_1969_MB.2Fs.29 / SATA Express. If the motherboard, drives, cards, all support the latest and greatest. I see 6TB drives are at Canada Computers ... for only $359. 8-) http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=15_1086_210_212&item_id=078864 No stock, of course. ----- Original Message ----- > From: William Park > To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2015 5:06 AM > Subject: Re: [kwlug-disc] Data transfer speeds SATA to SATA > > On Mon, Sep 21, 2015 at 11:23:25PM -0400, Andrew Kohlsmith wrote: >> > On Sep 21, 2015, at 10:50 PM, William Park wrote: >> >> The motherboard is a bit older (Socket 775/Core 2 generation), not > sure if >> >> an upgrade would help (I'd probably buy an inexpensive Socket > FM2+), but if >> > >> > Forget AMD. Go with Intel. >> >> While I too prefer Intel over AMD, I don???t think the CPU is actually >> doing much to help or hinder the transfers. Everything will be DMA???d >> from one buffer to another, with the CPU just minding the transfers >> and waiting for them to complete. > > Yes, when I said "Intel", I meant Intel cpu, chipset, and motherboards > are better. I had AMD 8-core 125W system, and it would choke when doing > any IO. The cpu/memory bandwidth was ok, judging by kernel compile > times. I replaced it with i3, because I could no longer afford > electricity. From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Sat Sep 26 15:40:07 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 15:40:07 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? Message-ID: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> Hi all, Right now, I'm carrying around 2 USB sticks, - one 32GB -- it boots Linux and contains about 10 bootable ISOs. - one 8GB -- to 'dd' the real ISO that I want to boot. It's 2-step process, and it's ok. But, I would like to reduce it to 1-step. How can I boot those multiple ISOs directly from one USB stick? -- William From bjonkman at sobac.com Sat Sep 26 16:06:37 2015 From: bjonkman at sobac.com (Bob Jonkman) Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 16:06:37 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I had multi-os booting on a USB stick running for quite a while on a 16 GB USB thumbdrive. Sadly, I lost that drive, and haven't quite rebuilt it on a new 64 GB thumbdrive I got to replace it. Essentially, I installed PC-GRUB (GRUB 0.99) onto the stick, then used a manually created menu to select an .iso file to mount as the 'loop' device. This is the only bookmark I have about multi-OS USB sticks: http://knightwise.com/portable-multi-booting-operating-systems-on-a-stick/ It is not what I ended up using. A quick search for 'linux multi-os bootable usb drive grub' returns a *lot* more hits than it used to when I created my first multi-os bootable thumbdrive. https://ixquick.com/do/search?query=linux+multi-os+bootable+usb+drive+grub - --Bob, who apologizes for providing a non-answer Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! On 26/09/15 03:40 PM, William Park wrote: > Hi all, > > Right now, I'm carrying around 2 USB sticks, - one 32GB -- it boots > Linux and contains about 10 bootable ISOs. - one 8GB -- to 'dd' the > real ISO that I want to boot. > > It's 2-step process, and it's ok. But, I would like to reduce it > to 1-step. > > How can I boot those multiple ISOs directly from one USB stick? > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability iEYEARECAAYFAlYG+swACgkQuRKJsNLM5erNUgCg8FAFOQARl0LoVLbO4kbUsqvw j4QAoOI5XsllM6Wtp21DrY2LoZttXMaK =joUT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From brian at nickle.ca Sat Sep 26 16:36:23 2015 From: brian at nickle.ca (Nickle, Brian) Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 16:36:23 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> Message-ID: I've recently been using easy2boot https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://m.easy2boot.com/&ved=0CBsQFjAAahUKEwjg7MOCxpXIAhUMHT4KHRL7CNY&usg=AFQjCNHcaFV0Acf0MC0KNJxyngt96GYvQA&sig2=9rVaDxixf1B3L3zVD1-iNA to make multi boot USB drives. I think you need to create the disk in windows but after that it will just detect any ISO or floppy image you put on it and boot. Thanks Brian Sent from my mobile. On 26 Sep 2015 4:08 pm, "Bob Jonkman" wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > I had multi-os booting on a USB stick running for quite a while on a > 16 GB USB thumbdrive. Sadly, I lost that drive, and haven't quite > rebuilt it on a new 64 GB thumbdrive I got to replace it. > > Essentially, I installed PC-GRUB (GRUB 0.99) onto the stick, then used > a manually created menu to select an .iso file to mount as the 'loop' > device. > > This is the only bookmark I have about multi-OS USB sticks: > > > http://knightwise.com/portable-multi-booting-operating-systems-on-a-stick/ > > It is not what I ended up using. A quick search for 'linux multi-os > bootable usb drive grub' returns a *lot* more hits than it used to > when I created my first multi-os bootable thumbdrive. > > > https://ixquick.com/do/search?query=linux+multi-os+bootable+usb+drive+grub > > - --Bob, who apologizes for providing a non-answer > > > Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 > Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga > https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca > Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! > > > On 26/09/15 03:40 PM, William Park wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > Right now, I'm carrying around 2 USB sticks, - one 32GB -- it boots > > Linux and contains about 10 bootable ISOs. - one 8GB -- to 'dd' the > > real ISO that I want to boot. > > > > It's 2-step process, and it's ok. But, I would like to reduce it > > to 1-step. > > > > How can I boot those multiple ISOs directly from one USB stick? > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability > > iEYEARECAAYFAlYG+swACgkQuRKJsNLM5erNUgCg8FAFOQARl0LoVLbO4kbUsqvw > j4QAoOI5XsllM6Wtp21DrY2LoZttXMaK > =joUT > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bs27975 at yahoo.ca Sat Sep 26 19:14:56 2015 From: bs27975 at yahoo.ca (B.S.) Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 23:14:56 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <1918028494.1396824.1443309296714.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Are any of these persistent? i.e. you can make changes, create documents, etc., and when you shut down the state is written back to the stick? Not meaning to hijack the thread, but ... IIRC, all this stuff reacts differently on external drives (which behave exactly like internal drives, but slower?), than on sticks, it seems. So, if you used a small, 2.5", usb powered, external drive, would your life be easier? Perhaps even an SSD, for speed / robustness? e.g. Could use standard grub / multiple partitions? - not suggesting not using .iso's, for space concerns. Mind you ... you could also default install an iso to a partition, given the larger space of drives over sticks, and grub would just let you go to the desired partition of that moment. (And give you persistence, for that matter. Create a 'data' partition, and each os could mount it, and you'd have persistent docs/files across OS', even.) Would have to sit in a back pocket, not a front pocket, and you don't want to be sitting on it ... but if you do this a lot, perhaps the speed gain is worth the inconvenience? Happened to just glance at my phone ... hmmm, about the same form factor. Could fit in a phone hip holster or shirt pocket? ----- Original Message ----- > From: William Park > To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > Cc: > Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2015 3:40 PM > Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? > > Hi all, > > Right now, I'm carrying around 2 USB sticks, > - one 32GB -- it boots Linux and contains about 10 bootable ISOs. > - one 8GB -- to 'dd' the real ISO that I want to boot. > > It's 2-step process, and it's ok. But, I would like to reduce it to > 1-step. > > How can I boot those multiple ISOs directly from one USB stick? From crankyoldbugger at gmail.com Sat Sep 26 20:14:01 2015 From: crankyoldbugger at gmail.com (CrankyOldBugger) Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 00:14:01 +0000 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> Message-ID: I made a multi-boot flash drive on a Windows client using YUMI. It's very easy to follow. Sorry, I don't know the Linux equivalent of this. On Sat, 26 Sep 2015 at 16:09 Bob Jonkman wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > I had multi-os booting on a USB stick running for quite a while on a > 16 GB USB thumbdrive. Sadly, I lost that drive, and haven't quite > rebuilt it on a new 64 GB thumbdrive I got to replace it. > > Essentially, I installed PC-GRUB (GRUB 0.99) onto the stick, then used > a manually created menu to select an .iso file to mount as the 'loop' > device. > > This is the only bookmark I have about multi-OS USB sticks: > > > http://knightwise.com/portable-multi-booting-operating-systems-on-a-stick/ > > It is not what I ended up using. A quick search for 'linux multi-os > bootable usb drive grub' returns a *lot* more hits than it used to > when I created my first multi-os bootable thumbdrive. > > > https://ixquick.com/do/search?query=linux+multi-os+bootable+usb+drive+grub > > - --Bob, who apologizes for providing a non-answer > > > Bob Jonkman Phone: +1-519-635-9413 > Candidate for the Green Party of Canada in Kitchener-Conestoga > https://bobjonkmangpc.ca/ mailto:bob.jonkman at greenparty.ca > Vote for the person who will best represent you in your riding! > > > On 26/09/15 03:40 PM, William Park wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > Right now, I'm carrying around 2 USB sticks, - one 32GB -- it boots > > Linux and contains about 10 bootable ISOs. - one 8GB -- to 'dd' the > > real ISO that I want to boot. > > > > It's 2-step process, and it's ok. But, I would like to reduce it > > to 1-step. > > > > How can I boot those multiple ISOs directly from one USB stick? > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.20 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability > > iEYEARECAAYFAlYG+swACgkQuRKJsNLM5erNUgCg8FAFOQARl0LoVLbO4kbUsqvw > j4QAoOI5XsllM6Wtp21DrY2LoZttXMaK > =joUT > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > _______________________________________________ > kwlug-disc mailing list > kwlug-disc at kwlug.org > http://kwlug.org/mailman/listinfo/kwlug-disc_kwlug.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From locklin.jason at gmail.com Sun Sep 27 11:59:41 2015 From: locklin.jason at gmail.com (Jason Locklin) Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 11:59:41 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <1918028494.1396824.1443309296714.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <1918028494.1396824.1443309296714.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5608126D.7030400@gmail.com> On 26/09/15 07:14 PM, B.S. wrote: > Are any of these persistent? i.e. you can make changes, create documents, etc., and when you shut down the state is written back to the stick? > > Not meaning to hijack the thread, but ... IIRC, all this stuff reacts differently on external drives (which behave exactly like internal drives, but slower?), than on sticks, it seems. > > So, if you used a small, 2.5", usb powered, external drive, would your life be easier? Perhaps even an SSD, for speed / robustness? e.g. Could use standard grub / multiple partitions? Actually, no, there is no difference between the two types of physical hardware. The difference is booting ISOs vs. installed systems. For instance, the same dd command *could* be used to copy an ISO to a thumb drive or an external hard drive to boot from -- but this would only allow a single os at a time. Conversely you can install one or more systems to a thumb drive or an external hard drive, using GRUB (partitioning as normal). It's the same whether its one type of device or the other. The trick is getting Grub to boot from a list of ISOs on a drive. The grub trick Bob mentioned or the windows scripts mentioned by Brian and CrankyOldButter should work on either device as well --but I gave up last time I tried to do it. -Jason From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Sun Sep 27 12:31:19 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 12:31:19 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <5608126D.7030400@gmail.com> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <1918028494.1396824.1443309296714.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <5608126D.7030400@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20150927163119.GA10727@node1.localdomain> On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 11:59:41AM -0400, Jason Locklin wrote: > > > On 26/09/15 07:14 PM, B.S. wrote: > >Are any of these persistent? i.e. you can make changes, create > >documents, etc., and when you shut down the state is written back to > >the stick? > > > >Not meaning to hijack the thread, but ... IIRC, all this stuff reacts > >differently on external drives (which behave exactly like internal > >drives, but slower?), than on sticks, it seems. > > > >So, if you used a small, 2.5", usb powered, external drive, would > >your life be easier? Perhaps even an SSD, for speed / robustness? > >e.g. Could use standard grub / multiple partitions? > > Actually, no, there is no difference between the two types of physical > hardware. The difference is booting ISOs vs. installed systems. For > instance, the same dd command *could* be used to copy an ISO to a thumb > drive or an external hard drive to boot from -- but this would only allow a > single os at a time. Conversely you can install one or more systems to a > thumb drive or an external hard drive, using GRUB (partitioning as normal). > It's the same whether its one type of device or the other. > > The trick is getting Grub to boot from a list of ISOs on a drive. The grub > trick Bob mentioned or the windows scripts mentioned by Brian and > CrankyOldButter should work on either device as well --but I gave up last > time I tried to do it. -Jason I tried "unetbootin". It extracts ISO and puts the contents in a partition. That's why you see "supported OS/filesystem" in its documentation. I thought it meant the OS it will be running under. But, it turned out to mean the OS it will extract, because it has to find the kernel/initrd. Initially, you only have to carry 1 USB stick. But, when you add/update new ISO, maintenance is much more. -- William From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Sun Sep 27 12:55:27 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 12:55:27 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> Message-ID: <20150927165526.GB3829@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 12:14:01AM +0000, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > I made a multi-boot flash drive on a Windows client using YUMI. It's very > easy to follow. > > Sorry, I don't know the Linux equivalent of this. One low-level answer is to use SYSLINUX, which now supports booting directly off of ISOs. This is not that helpful, though, because most (all?) Linux ISOs you care about are hybrid ISOs, which makes booting from SYSLINUX more difficult: http://www.syslinux.org/wiki/index.php/MEMDISK#ISO_images It takes some work to set up the initial infrastructure for SYSLINUX. The advantage is that once you set up this infrastructure adding additional ISOs should be relatively quick. We do this for our network installers using PXELINUX. It looks like this project automates some of the grunt work in creating multiboot USB images from Linux: http://multibootusb.org/ Of course, this is also not helpful because I have not personally used this project. - Paul -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org From opengeometry at yahoo.ca Sun Sep 27 18:37:50 2015 From: opengeometry at yahoo.ca (William Park) Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 18:37:50 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <20150927165526.GB3829@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> <20150927165526.GB3829@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> Message-ID: <20150927223750.GA14392@node1.localdomain> On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 12:55:27PM -0400, Paul Nijjar wrote: > On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 12:14:01AM +0000, CrankyOldBugger wrote: > > I made a multi-boot flash drive on a Windows client using YUMI. It's very > > easy to follow. > > > > Sorry, I don't know the Linux equivalent of this. > > One low-level answer is to use SYSLINUX, which now supports booting > directly off of ISOs. This is not that helpful, though, because most > (all?) Linux ISOs you care about are hybrid ISOs, which makes booting from > SYSLINUX more difficult: > > http://www.syslinux.org/wiki/index.php/MEMDISK#ISO_images > > It takes some work to set up the initial infrastructure for SYSLINUX. > The advantage is that once you set up this infrastructure adding > additional ISOs should be relatively quick. We do this for our network > installers using PXELINUX. > > It looks like this project automates some of the grunt work in > creating multiboot USB images from Linux: > > http://multibootusb.org/ > > Of course, this is also not helpful because I have not personally used > this project. > > - Paul Starting point of Syslinux (memdisk) is what I was looking for. - kernel is "memdisk" and initrd is ISO image, so configuration is easy to maintain. - it finds the ISO -- you see dots filling the screen as ISO is loaded. - ISO boots -- you see the splash screen of ISO. Then, it complains it can't find the live filesystem, the very image it just loaded. MultibootUSB.org extracts ISO, and puts the content into a partition. This is not what I want. I give up. Thanks guys. -- William From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Mon Sep 28 13:29:32 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2015 13:29:32 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] question -- booting from multiple ISOs in USB stick? In-Reply-To: <20150927223750.GA14392@node1.localdomain> References: <20150926194007.GA3100@node1.localdomain> <5606FACD.9020307@sobac.com> <20150927165526.GB3829@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> <20150927223750.GA14392@node1.localdomain> Message-ID: <20150928172931.GA3691@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 06:37:50PM -0400, William Park wrote: > > Starting point of Syslinux (memdisk) is what I was looking for. > - kernel is "memdisk" and initrd is ISO image, so configuration is > easy to maintain. > - it finds the ISO -- you see dots filling the screen as ISO is > loaded. > - ISO boots -- you see the splash screen of ISO. > Then, it complains it can't find the live filesystem, the very image it > just loaded. Yes, I have found this with the Ubuntu LiveCDs as well. I ended up extracting the contents and pointing them to an nfsroot, which does not help with USB booting. Here is the stanza that worked, for what it is worth: LABEL saucy-gui kernel ubuntu/saucy/i386-gui/vmlinuz append ro boot=casper only-ubiquity netboot=nfs nfsroot=172.26.107.3:/home/ftp/ubuntu/saucy/i386/ initrd=ubuntu/saucy/i386-gui/initrd.lz quiet splash -- (the "append" line should all be one line) The memdisk method works well for installer-only ISOs and a few other (usually DOS-based) live CDs. I guess I should have been more explicit about this in my earlier response. > > MultibootUSB.org extracts ISO, and puts the content into a partition. > This is not what I want. What happens now? How do things work with your two-USB solution? - Paul -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org From paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca Wed Sep 30 18:41:56 2015 From: paul_nijjar at yahoo.ca (Paul Nijjar) Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2015 18:41:56 -0400 Subject: [kwlug-disc] Future meeting topics Message-ID: <20150930224156.GF3794@nb-heartburn.theworkingcentre.org> I have a nagging feeling that somebody offered to make a KWLUG presentation recently, but I do not remember what it is. If you remember (and/or if it was you) could you get in touch? - Paul -- http://pnijjar.freeshell.org "How to Win Proportional Representation" talk: Oct 28.