[kwlug-disc] Summary: To be decided Monday - kwlug will meet at King & William going forward?

Lori Paniak ldpaniak at fourpisolutions.com
Sun Jan 3 12:25:55 EST 2010

When is the next meeting of the "committee"? 

On Sun, 2010-01-03 at 12:08 -0500, unsolicited wrote:
> Summary:
> kwlug is looking for a new meeting location.
> [1] Meeting location criteria post.
> [2] New meeting location sourced.
> [3] Proposal to committee to host kwlug without charge.
> The committee that can approve meeting space without charge to kwlug
> meets Wednesday - kwlug must decide at this Monday's meeting if it
> wishes to be represented to the committee (as per [3]) and hold future
> meetings at King & William.
> [Messages have been variously snipped and edited.]
> =====
> [1] Meeting location criteria post.
> unsolicited wrote, On 12/16/2009 4:58 PM:
> > Received: Wednesday, December 9, 2009, 10:26 AM From: Paul Nijjar 
> > To: kwlug-disc at kwlug.org Subject: [kwlug-disc] New locations 
> > brainstorming As some of you know, we have likely lost the Huether 
> > as a meeting location.
> Speaking of (new) meeting locations, perhaps it would help if we
> discussed the characteristics of what we'd like to see. Perhaps
> Santa will be good to kwlug this year.
> Overall I liked the Huether. I would be happy to go back there. I
> parked at the Waterloo Public Library for free and walked two short
> blocks. I liked not having to go anywhere to grab a bite.
> Wherever we go, we're going to need to manage and meet the
> expectations of whomever our hosts are, particularly if the space is
> free. If the space is free I'd guess we'll have to show that we are of
> interest to their other patrons - show that we are relevant to the
> K-W community within which that free space sits. And kwlug will
> have to change to some extent. Of course, too great a change would
> be unwelcome by kwlug and the candidate site rejected.
> We also need to know what sort of meeting space we'd like to see.
> Which is what I'd like to open for discussion in this thread.
> Some thoughts to seed the discussion:
> - cost of entry must be absolutely free.
> - reasonably nearby parking of sufficient size must be free.
> - on a main bus route.
> - big enough, for, say, 40 people, on average.
> - chairs; perhaps some tables for those with laptops; projection screen
> - reasonably quiet. Working Centre noise is what drove us to look
> for alternative sites.
> - preferable, but we seem to manage if the site doesn't have them to
> hand: projector, some form of sound system (unless the space is
> small and quiet enough to not need them.) Best if even Khalid
> doesn't need a microphone.
>    - white board? Meeting signs to direct people? One of those giant
> pads of paper and stand?
> - would be nice if larger alternate on-site space were available
> by pre-arrangement for the better attended topics, e.g. MythTV.
> - would be nice if there was space on-site to grab a bite rather
> than having to go elsewhere. Such would also probably facilitate our
> 'ask your neighbour' recommendation. Would space, but no restaurant,
> be acceptable?
> - personally I'd prefer to be in K-W, and not the heck the other side
> of Kitchener.
> - Free internet access present. Of some reasonable speed. We have
> shown that we can largely do without, at the Working Centre, but I
> don't think people really want to. Too many netbooks are present
> such that I think given two relatively equal choices - one with
> access, one without, the internet location will be chosen hands
> down. Even if only for the presenters to be able to show us the
> web site of whatever they're presenting on.
> - not at the Universities - aside from the cost of parking, I think
> we collide with similar groups already on campus, and they have a
> slightly different direction than kwlug. (Nothing prevents people
> from attending both.) kwlug seems focused upon 'downtown everyman',
> not post-secondary students / academia. No offense to anyone.
> There's another aspect that I think we should also discuss. Manulife
> would have been a fantastic place to meet, probably a really nice
> setting and environment, but perhaps off-putting to some. On the
> other hand, the Working Centre, given its raison d'etre, is
> inherently visible and welcoming to newcomers. Not as stark as a
> gymnasium but probably not as swank as Manulife. Does the kwlug
> community have a preference or leaning towards one environment or the
> other?
> =====
> [2] New meeting location sourced.
> unsolicited wrote, On 12/18/2009 5:04 PM:
> Dear kwlug:
> I have sourced an alternate meeting site.
> Directions:
> http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Caroline+St+S+%26+William+St+W,+Waterloo,+Waterloo+Regional+Municipality,+Ontario&t=h&msa=0&ll=43.46171,-80.522473&spn=0.0008,0.001725&z=19&msid=117888502896854960306.00047a9014cd31c690a31
> Pictures:
> http://www.zooomr.com/photos/bsimageszooomr/sets/53122/view-detail/
> As far as I can tell, it meets all of kwlug's meeting requirements,
> and more.
> The idea of a permanent 'home' for kwlug, in the sense of more space
> and facilities than we could ever use, is rather exciting.
> =====
> [3] Proposal to committee to host kwlug without charge.
> unsolicited wrote, On 12/31/2009 2:52 PM:
> Dear kwlug:
> Please find below a final draft of what Mike, the First United
> coordinator, would propose to his committee in seeking approval for
> kwlug to be granted room(s) without cost.
> If there is a consensus at the Jan. 4th meeting, the approving
> committee meets next Wednesday (6th), and Mike will take it to them
> then.
> Mike will attend the Monday kwlug meeting to answer any site questions.
> - ignore any reference to hardware. It is not a condition of being
> granted the space. In principle I have already addressed and solved
> these hardware issues. The only point at the moment is: Does kwlug
> want to take advantage of this free space, given the conditions under
> which the use of the space was (will be) approved, as shown below.
> - it is understood that new member time is not currently being
> offered, probably for lack of attendance. (No point staffing
> something when nobody shows up.) If we again offer 6:00 - 7:00 PM
> (or presentation simultaneous) new member time, and nobody shows up,
> there's no point to offering it. We continue using the space and the
> current situation remains unchanged.
> - Mike will be the conduit for his new members. Until he's told
> that a new member is interested, there is no need for new member
> time. He is more than happy to be the only one present for that time,
> unless and until sufficient numbers show up that he needs help. (He's
> there anyways, to unlock the doors for us.)
> - we had new member time. I presume there is a willingness to have it
> again if there is an audience.
> even then if there is no demand - kwlug will continue to operate as
> it recently has. Mike expects nothing would change - kwlug would
> continue to be welcome to use the space for free, new member time or
> no, barring demand.
> [ed. <text>] comments in the text below are mine.
> -----
> (Remember - these are his word to his people, explaining what the
> heck a 'kwlug' is.)
> Outreach Proposal: KWLUG
> KWLUG is a Linux user group. They are a strong supporter of open
> source software. They can no longer meet at the Working Centre or the
> Huether hotel. They need a new home.
> The Working Centre, having completed its renovation to their two
> Queen St. buildings, introduced a public retail cafe immediately
> adjacent to their meeting space (no wall between), presumably in an
> attempt to defray some costs. The noise resulting from this newly
> introduced commercial activity had a drastic impact upon KWLUG
> meetings - it became significantly difficult to hear speakers, even
> with a microphone.
> Later, prior to November 2009, meetings were held at the Huether
> Hotel. Some members patronized the establishment afterwards - the
> weather permitted outside patio use. In December it was learned that
> the November meeting patronage levels were insufficient, patronage was
> down, presumably as the patio had become too cold. At the December
> meeting KWLUG was unexpectedly denied its usual meeting space at
> arrival - a new and different Huether representative told us that the
> required patronage ratio was actually expected to be more like 90%.
> KWLUG, being free, can promise nothing. Typically, perhaps a dozen
> people sit and snack after meetings. Now, 20 to 30 or more people were
> required, which has never happened, and can not be promised.
> *Vision/Reason*:
> - Computer education: kwlug uses Linux and open source and shares
> their experiences.
> - Help each other with computers. All need computer skills today -
> kwlug has always offered a venue to the community at large,
> congregation or not. (What is a presentation, if not computer help?)
> A basic premise of KWLUG is free to one and all - there are no
> membership fees or any monetary costs at all to participate.
> This is why I'm proposing allowing them to meet here as an outreach
> project, so that they can continue.
> *Responsible person(s)*: Mike S., Bill S.
> *Meeting space requirements*:
> - First non-holiday Monday of the month: new users 6-7 PM, meeting 7-9 PM.
> - Space preferred: Parlour, but could move to some other rooms.
> - Access to internet via dedicated box - to be turned on only when
> meeting, and stored on the church premises.
>    - Possible need for network drop in parlour – need to find that out.
> [Ignore hardware issues for the purposes of this kwlug thread /
> decision. No drop is required, but presence would be very helpful.]
> *Advantages to the church:*
> - Provides premise public internet access via a dedicated piece of
> equipment to interested groups in the building - could be a value add.
> [Since the internet value add idea has only come up now, kwlug is not
> jumping into the deep end of the pool here - at this point there isn't
> even a pool. They've obviously had insufficient demand for internet
> access to date.]
> - Having computer expertise available would hopefully provide a
> service to our groups. [i.e. perhaps a kwlug member(s), given their
> expertise and now being familiar with the location, may be willing
> to help out at a church function. Certainly I myself would - I would
> anyways.]
> - No cost computer education opportunities are important.
> - Open source software, including equivalents to commercial software,
> is free. Zero cost of entry means everyone can take advantage of it.
> e.g. Microsoft Windows and Microsoft Office equivalents. Often, older
> computers gain new life.
> - Presentations provide more depth to various topics.
> - Frequently, having simple questions answered in an informal setting
> by others who have been there and done that is all that is needed to
> be away to the races. To date the problem has been: Given typical
> people costs, who can I afford to ask? kwlug is a mentoring and
> support presence in our community, has been for some years now, and
> needs a home.
> [ed. It is understood that we are a Linux group, and don't do
> 'Computer 101'.]
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